[Joe Sr.]

And I used to use the oven to sanitize bottles too before I started kegging.  If I bottle now, it's usually with a Beer Gun.

How does the beer gun change your bottle sanitation procedures?

[HoosierBrew]

And I used to use the oven to sanitize bottles too before I started kegging.  If I bottle now, it's usually with a Beer Gun.
[/quote

How does the beer gun change your bottle sanitation procedures?

It doesn't. Just that way back when I used to bottle batches I sanitized them all in the oven. Now , on the odd time that I bottle a few from the keg, the bottles get a good soak in Starsan , or sprayed thoroughly with it.

[Joe Sr.]

And I used to use the oven to sanitize bottles too before I started kegging.  If I bottle now, it's usually with a Beer Gun.
[/quote

How does the beer gun change your bottle sanitation procedures?

It doesn't. Just that way back when I used to bottle batches I sanitized them all in the oven. Now , on the odd time that I bottle a few from the keg, the bottles get a good soak in Starsan , or sprayed thoroughly with it.

I was just being a d*ck.

[HoosierBrew]

And I used to use the oven to sanitize bottles too before I started kegging.  If I bottle now, it's usually with a Beer Gun.
[/quote

How does the beer gun change your bottle sanitation procedures?

It doesn't. Just that way back when I used to bottle batches I sanitized them all in the oven. Now , on the odd time that I bottle a few from the keg, the bottles get a good soak in Starsan , or sprayed thoroughly with it.

I was just being a d*ck.

All good 

[troybinso]

When you guys use the dishwasher, how can you be sure that the spray is getting up in to the bottles? It seems like that is a pretty small hole for the spray to get all the way up in to.

[Joe Sr.]

I don't know about PBR, but back in the day Old Style was notorious for it's ability to "clean the system."

Old Pile, as it was affectionately known.

[fmader]

When you guys use the dishwasher, how can you be sure that the spray is getting up in to the bottles? It seems like that is a pretty small hole for the spray to get all the way up in to.

It has nothing to do with water. I'm not washing my bottles in the dishwasher. I wash them in the sink with oxiclean. It's all about the heat of the dishwasher. The heat sanitizes the bottles.

[denny]

When you guys use the dishwasher, how can you be sure that the spray is getting up in to the bottles? It seems like that is a pretty small hole for the spray to get all the way up in to.

It has nothing to do with water. I'm not washing my bottles in the dishwasher. I wash them in the sink with oxiclean. It's all about the heat of the dishwasher. The heat sanitizes the bottles.

Be aware that heat sanitizing will shorten the reuse life of your bottles.  That may or may not matter to you.

[gmac]

When you guys use the dishwasher, how can you be sure that the spray is getting up in to the bottles? It seems like that is a pretty small hole for the spray to get all the way up in to.

It has nothing to do with water. I'm not washing my bottles in the dishwasher. I wash them in the sink with oxiclean. It's all about the heat of the dishwasher. The heat sanitizes the bottles.

Be aware that heat sanitizing will shorten the reuse life of your bottles.  That may or may not matter to you.

They really get that hot?  I wouldn't have guessed that.  I do think that there is a big difference between the bottles used in the US and the ones used in Canada.  We've had beer bottle re-use by the big breweries for years, I'm unsure if the US does the same but I think our bottles are thicker and they seem thicker when I look at them in order to be re-used more frequently.

[denny]

They really get that hot?  I wouldn't have guessed that.  I do think that there is a big difference between the bottles used in the US and the ones used in Canada.  We've had beer bottle re-use by the big breweries for years, I'm unsure if the US does the same but I think our bottles are thicker and they seem thicker when I look at them in order to be re-used more frequently.

The theory is that the repeated heating and cooling induces stress fractures.  No personal experience, but that's what I've heard from people who do it.

[erockrph]

They really get that hot?  I wouldn't have guessed that.  I do think that there is a big difference between the bottles used in the US and the ones used in Canada.  We've had beer bottle re-use by the big breweries for years, I'm unsure if the US does the same but I think our bottles are thicker and they seem thicker when I look at them in order to be re-used more frequently.

The theory is that the repeated heating and cooling induces stress fractures.  No personal experience, but that's what I've heard from people who do it.

Maybe that's more of an issue when using dry heat in an oven, where you generally use higher temps for a longer period of time. I'm thinking that if the "Sanitize" setting on dishwashers lead to weakened glass, there'd be some kind of cautions on the machine. It would just take one glass baby bottle breaking in some kids face for some serious law suits.

I have bottles that have been through at least a couple dozen sanitize cycles with no ill effect that I can see. The only bottles that I have trouble with occasional breaks are Sierra Nevada ones. I think that is just an issue of my wing capper not working well with them, since they just seems to snap/crush at the neck.

[HoosierBrew]

I don't remember breaking or cracking bottles more often when sanitizing in the oven than when I cleaned by soaking in sanitizer. But I used to buy cases of empty long neck returnable bottles from a liquor store, though. Those were definitely thicker than a lot of the bottles you see today, so I'm sure that helped.

[S. cerevisiae]

It has nothing to do with water. I'm not washing my bottles in the dishwasher. I wash them in the sink with oxiclean. It's all about the heat of the dishwasher. The heat sanitizes the bottles.

More specifically, moist heat sanitizes the bottles.   Moist heat is a more efficient microbe killer than dry heat.  For example, it takes around ninety minutes to render lab glassware absolutely sterile at 350F/177C using dry heat.   However, lab glassware can be rendered absolutely sterile in fifteen minutes at 250F/121C using most heat.

By the way, OxyClean, like PBW is yet another cleaner that chemically resembles unscented automatic dishwasher detergent powder.

From the OxyClean MSDS (http://www.ahprofessional.com/_downloads/msds/MSDS-1605-OxiClean%20Versatile%20Stain%20Remover.pdf):

Sodium Carbonate  (alkalinity booster)
Sodium Percarbonate  (organic oxidizing agent)
Ethoxylated Alcohol C12 - C16 (surfactant)
Sodium Polycarboxylate (anti-redeposition agent)
Sodium Metasilicate (chelating agent)


Let's examine the list of ingredients that are in a box of unscented Cascade automatic dishwasher detergent powder (my comments are in parenthesis).

Sodium Carbonate
Sodium Sulfate (diluting agent)
Sodium Silicate (the umbrella name for the chemical compound known as sodium metasilicate)
Sodium Percarbonate
Modified polyacrylate  (anti-redeposition agent that belongs to the sodium polycarboxylate family)
Alcohol Alkoxylate  (surfactant)
Polyethylene glycol (processing aid)
Hydrozincite  (etching inhibitor)
Amine Cobalt Salt (bleach catalyst)
Protease Enzyme (this ingredient should be self-explanatory to any all-grain brewer)
Amylase Enzyme  (this ingredient should be self-explanatory to any all-grain brewer)

[brick pig]

I rinse the bottles with tap water 4 or 5 times immediately after emptying them and then store them upside down in the same plastic crates I use to store the full bottles. On bottling day I visually inspect them and if I see anything that looks like it needs to be scrubbed, I do so with plain water and a bottle brush. Then I send them through the dishwasher, no soap, on the "sanitize" setting.

I have been doing this for very nearly twenty years, and have had a grand total of exactly 1 gusher in all that time. Also, except for three or four that I've replaced because they accidentally got mixed in with recycling, I'm using the same six cases of bottles I got when I first started brewing. If the heat from the dishwasher is hurting them, it is taking an awfully long time to do so.

[gymrat]

I think it is ok to drink it..just be sure to get it poured before it gets out of the bottle and makes a mess.