Author Topic: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment  (Read 2559 times)

Offline trapae

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Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« on: May 12, 2014, 10:29:06 PM »
I just made an IPA and dry hopped with 2 ounces Centennial and your .5 ounce Chinook.  I'm thinking just to compare I will brew the same exact recipe but add those same amount of dry hops to the flameout addition and not dry hop at all.  Has anyone done this or something similar and if so, how was taste and aroma affected?
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Offline bbesser

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2014, 10:44:26 PM »
To me, it seems like you will end up with less aroma by adding to flameout rather than dry hop, but will get an increase in flavor.

My reasoning is that the active/vigorous fermentation in the primary will drive off some of the more volatile hop aroma contributed by the flameout additions. 

I say do it anyway and see what version you like the most.
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Offline goschman

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2014, 10:47:06 PM »
I have never tried the same recipe but have done many pale ales and ipa with flameout additions instead of dry hops. I thought the results were pretty decent but prefer doing both flameout and dry hop these days.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2014, 11:31:30 PM »
Amounts being equal, you'll get more intense hop flavor and aroma from the dry hop addition. Not that you won't make good beer from just a flavor and flameout addition, because you will. It just won't be as intense. American ale styles often benefit from dry hopping, but more subtle, clean beers like lagers typically benefit more from standard boiling additions.
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Offline denny

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2014, 02:50:43 PM »
I just made an IPA and dry hopped with 2 ounces Centennial and your .5 ounce Chinook.  I'm thinking just to compare I will brew the same exact recipe but add those same amount of dry hops to the flameout addition and not dry hop at all.  Has anyone done this or something similar and if so, how was taste and aroma affected?

Yes.  You get a tiny bit of flavor and bitterness from the flameout addition and not a lot of aroma.  With dry hops, you get a lot of aroma, a tiny bit of flavor and no bitterness.
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Offline gymrat

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2014, 05:15:58 PM »
I have been expeimenting with hop stands and getting as much aroma as I ever got dry hopping. I have been cooling my wort to 160, tossing the hops in, and waiting half an hour before turning my chiller back on.
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Offline denny

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2014, 06:18:20 PM »
I have been expeimenting with hop stands and getting as much aroma as I ever got dry hopping. I have been cooling my wort to 160, tossing the hops in, and waiting half an hour before turning my chiller back on.

Ya know, that's something I need to do more often!
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Offline erockrph

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2014, 06:26:47 PM »
I have been expeimenting with hop stands and getting as much aroma as I ever got dry hopping. I have been cooling my wort to 160, tossing the hops in, and waiting half an hour before turning my chiller back on.

And the bonus is a big boost in flavor along with the aroma contributions.
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Offline mugwort

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2014, 06:40:40 PM »
I have been expeimenting with hop stands and getting as much aroma as I ever got dry hopping. I have been cooling my wort to 160, tossing the hops in, and waiting half an hour before turning my chiller back on.

Same here.  In fact, after adopting that process it seems to me that additional hops via dry-hopping just change the aroma/flavor, but do not necessarily increase or intensify it.  Gives a dryer, less candy-like hop perception that I don't automatically find more tasty.  Sometimes I'd swear the hop character post-dry-hop is more muted than just prior.

Therefore my next IPA shall be a split batch.
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Offline trapae

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2014, 06:42:39 PM »
I guess we should all just brew more beer for the sake of experimentation.
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Offline denny

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #10 on: May 13, 2014, 06:43:16 PM »
Therefore my next IPA shall be a split batch.

Good on ya!
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #11 on: May 13, 2014, 06:48:40 PM »
I have been expeimenting with hop stands and getting as much aroma as I ever got dry hopping. I have been cooling my wort to 160, tossing the hops in, and waiting half an hour before turning my chiller back on.

And the bonus is a big boost in flavor along with the aroma contributions.

+1. Big boost. I've gone down to 170F so far and have liked it better than all other temps. I don't want the bitterness from a FO stand anyway, and flavor and aroma are really nice at the cooler stands. Aroma especially stays more intact at cooler temps.  Liking it.
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Offline goschman

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #12 on: May 13, 2014, 07:19:25 PM »
Doing a hop stand does contribute bitterness as well correct? I have been doing more pale ales so this is something I definitely need to try soon
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #13 on: May 13, 2014, 07:26:30 PM »
Doing a hop stand does contribute bitterness as well correct? I have been doing more pale ales so this is something I definitely need to try soon

Depends on the temp you add the hops at. If you add at flameout, yes you'll extract noticeable bitterness. If you account for this, it's not an issue. Maybe consider a flameout stand as roughly a 20 minute addition. But I prefer to cool to 185F or less and then add the hops for a stand. You extract much less bitterness at this temp and below, but you'll get better flavor and aroma character, which gets driven off at higher temperatures. Give it a try !
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Offline goschman

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Re: Flameout hop addition versus dry hop addition experiment
« Reply #14 on: May 13, 2014, 07:35:24 PM »
Doing a hop stand does contribute bitterness as well correct? I have been doing more pale ales so this is something I definitely need to try soon

Depends on the temp you add the hops at. If you add at flameout, yes you'll extract noticeable bitterness. If you account for this, it's not an issue. Maybe consider a flameout stand as roughly a 20 minute addition. But I prefer to cool to 185F or less and then add the hops for a stand. You extract much less bitterness at this temp and below, but you'll get better flavor and aroma character, which gets driven off at higher temperatures. Give it a try !

It looks like beersmith calculates a steep/whirlpool addition as 1/2 the amount of IBUs from an equal timed boil addition. So a 30 minute 'steep/whirlpool' addition is equal to 1/2 the amount IBUs of a 30 minute boil addition. I assume this is based on flameout but it does not specify.

Maybe I will replace my dry hop addition with a lower temp hop stand addition on the next attempt.
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