[klickitat jim]

My next brew day is a couple sours. I'm pitching Roesalare in each. I've ordered 4 propogators. Do you guys make starters? Do you guys oxygenate the wort before pitching?

The beers are each 5 gallon in the neighborhood of 1.055. Would two packs each be enough without a starter?

[AmandaK]

No starters with the sour mixes. I usually do a smack pack in 5 gallons and then pitch bottle dregs of things I like. I do not oxygenate as most everything I do is soured in the secondary. I also do not oxygenate my lambics that get 3278 pitched in the primary.

[klickitat jim]

Makes sense. I'll be pitching Roesalare from the beginning though. I don't plan on saving the trube obviously so maybe I'll pitch two packs in each and skip o2

[Kinetic]

My last Roesalare plus Brett dregs beer was 1.064 OG, finished at 7.8% after 6 months.  Didn't use oxygen.  Used one smack pack.  No starter for Roeselare.  Small starter for the brett dregs.  Added fruit to the primary after 1 month.  Left everything in the primary for 6 months.  The end result was a mouth watering sour with a big brett note.

 

[kylekohlmorgen]

You really only need one pack per 5 gallons, as long as its fairly fresh.

If its an older pack, you could add a bit of dry yeast to round out the sacch cell count.

If you're pitching into more than 1 container, its a good opportunity to experiment with the mixed cultures.

Use two different mixed cultures (Roselare and a lambic blend, BugFarm, individual cultures, etc),
pitch one in primary and one in secondary (after sacch ferment),
lactic fermentation in one before pitching the mixed culture,
use the Roselare in one, bottle dregs in the other,
Aerate one but not the other (I would be REALLY interested in this since I haven't done it),
etc. etc. etc.

If you mix up the fermentation of the same wort, you'll also have more flavor options to work with on the back end, eventually blending for a more complex final beer.

[klickitat jim]

Its two different worts. A flanders red ish that will get 10lbs cherries in a month, and a triple based recipe that will get 10lbs peaches.

[AmandaK]

Remember, don't put the beer on your timetable.

It will let you know when it is time to add fruits (if any) or any other additions. Beer cannot be put on a schedule and sour beer is even more unruly when it comes to time frames. It'll be ready when it's ready. Best thing to do is forget about it for the first 6-8 months and then try it. From there you can wait some more (likely) or actually do something with it (less likely).

[klickitat jim]

As a last minute adjustment I'm using speidel 30L fermentor so I upped my volumes. Roughly 8 gallons each final volume then I'll just top off with the fruit additions. Thinking that will limit head space and O2 uptake a little better.

[kylekohlmorgen]

Remember, don't put the beer on your timetable.

It will let you know when it is time to add fruits (if any) or any other additions. Beer cannot be put on a schedule and sour beer is even more unruly when it comes to time frames. It'll be ready when it's ready. Best thing to do is forget about it for the first 6-8 months and then try it. From there you can wait some more (likely) or actually do something with it (less likely).

+1

You want the gravity to level out for at least a month or two before adding fruit. Here's why:

To minimize overpressure in the bottle, you have to wait for secondary fermentation to complete. If its not complete before the fruit is added, you have to wait for the fruit sugars AND the rest of the complex sugars/carbs to be fermented. The fruit flavor fades before you can get the finished beer in a bottle.

Fill those fermentors up to the top and let 'em sit for at least 6 months. Once gravity is stable for 6 weeks or so, add fruit.

If you need more headspace when adding fruit, pull off some of the base beer for bottling/kegging or transfer into a larger container. Don't leave headspace for the fruit at the start of fermentation - you'll pick up more oxygen than you want.
 

[klickitat jim]

Copy that. I'll recalculate

[klickitat jim]

I ended up filling my 30L fermentor to about 4" from the top for primary. I'm going to try my idea of topping off with the fruit foe reducing headspace. Eyeballing it is guess I can get what I need in there. I want ten pounds cherries and ten of peaches minimum. If it won't fir I'll rack some beer off.

[klickitat jim]

Checked on my babies this morning. Both are bubbling away happily. They are throwing a wonderful belgian ester aroma with a cherry/pear background. Ooooh I think these will be yummy

[ynotbrusum]

That sounds great, Jim.  I have a solera going between a year old Oaked 5 gallons and a separate glass 5 gallons, then blending back to the glass based batch on a 5 to 1 basis for serving.  My 2 month old is progressing nicely to pellicle for next year's load... I am biased, but this kicks Monk's Cafe and Rodenbach's butt IMHO....I bet yours will be great, too with that fruit addition.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[klickitat jim]

Ya I went to Logsdon's Farmhouse a month ago and was instantly sold on the cherry Flanders and peche farmhouse styles. Swore I'd never brew wild or with fruit... don't rule out doing beers you've never tried awesome examples of.

[HoosierBrew]

Swore I'd never brew wild or with fruit... don't rule out doing beers you've never tried awesome examples of.

+1 to that.