Author Topic: Burning your bag in BIAB?  (Read 1441 times)

Offline Lazy Ant Brewing

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Burning your bag in BIAB?
« on: August 04, 2014, 07:09:01 AM »
I'm in the process of gathering info for purchasing BIAB equipment. 

Would a brew pot with a vegetable strainer basket in it keep the bag far enough away from the bottom of the pot that you wouldn't have to worry about burning holes in the bag?

The pots with the strainers would cost more, but might be worth it also because the wire bale on the strainer basket would providing a secure means of lifting the bag out without putting undue stress on the bag.

Comments please.

Offline morticaixavier

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2014, 07:12:01 AM »
If you can get one large enough or are doing small batches it should work.

Offline Joe T

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2014, 07:16:01 AM »
Sounds like a good idea. I have never burned my bag and I typically do a mash out. But I've heard it can happen.

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2014, 07:23:47 AM »
That is how a guy in our club does it. He uses one of those collapsible colanders, upside down, as a false bottom.
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Offline Lazy Ant Brewing

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2014, 07:29:33 AM »
I'm looking at an 80 qt pot with a vegetable strainer basket.  It's made of 2 mm aluminum.  It's a Carolina Cooker basket from agri.supply.com
It's advertised at $119.95, but I haven't looked at shipping costs yet.

Offline duncan

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2014, 07:49:16 AM »
Cool idea!

I burned my bag once on the bottom of the pot. Now I use a bungee chord to secure the bag around the rim of pot and have the bottom of the bag hover a couple of inches above the bottom. I just push down on the center of the bag with my spoon until i feel it hit the bottom, then I pull on the sides of the bag hanging below the bungees to get it to hover a few inches. It has held well for my 3-gal batch grist weights.

Let us know how the basket works out, if you try it!

-d

Offline Lazy Ant Brewing

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2014, 07:54:21 AM »
I suppose a guy could mark the length of the bag when it was positioned about 2 inches above the bottom in some fashion and then use a bungee cord or heavy duty clips to keep it at that level.

Offline chromegelatin

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80 qt stainless for the same cost. Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2014, 08:45:17 AM »
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=80+qt+stainless&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.X80+qt+stainless+concor&_nkw=80+qt+stainless+concord&_sacat=0

I think aluminum is ok.  With stainless you don't need to worry as much about what cleaner you use.  Also if you have a real acidic wort like a berliner weisse, aluminum can be... problematic.

Also from everything i have read.  If you aren't firing the pot or the electric element during the mash you don't need to worry about scorching the bag.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2014, 08:47:26 AM by chromegelatin »

Offline mattybrass

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2014, 06:36:59 AM »
This site has some great options for BIAB.

http://www.brewinabag.com/

Offline erockrph

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2014, 07:26:04 AM »
If you don't heat your kettle during the mash you never have to worry about scorching. Insulating your kettle during the mash should help you keep your heat loss to an acceptable level.

If you're thinking of doing step mashes with BIAB, I think you're a lot better off doing it as a separate infusion. Directly heating your kettle during the mash can create hot spots. If you're worried about scorching your bag you should have the same concerns about the enzymes in your mash as well.
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2014, 08:44:15 AM »
If you don't heat your kettle during the mash you never have to worry about scorching. Insulating your kettle during the mash should help you keep your heat loss to an acceptable level.

If you're thinking of doing step mashes with BIAB, I think you're a lot better off doing it as a separate infusion. Directly heating your kettle during the mash can create hot spots. If you're worried about scorching your bag you should have the same concerns about the enzymes in your mash as well.
You can apply heat if the grains and bag are not close to the bottom of the kettle. I think the guy in the club recirculates while applying heat. If I make it to the club meeting on Friday I can ask him.
 
As for the enzymes denaturing, well many in this area do a RIMS approach all of the time with a false bottom and a pump. You just need to be judicious with the heat.
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Offline beersk

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2014, 08:53:52 AM »
If you don't heat your kettle during the mash you never have to worry about scorching. Insulating your kettle during the mash should help you keep your heat loss to an acceptable level.

If you're thinking of doing step mashes with BIAB, I think you're a lot better off doing it as a separate infusion. Directly heating your kettle during the mash can create hot spots. If you're worried about scorching your bag you should have the same concerns about the enzymes in your mash as well.
You can apply heat if the grains and bag are not close to the bottom of the kettle. I think the guy in the club recirculates while applying heat. If I make it to the club meeting on Friday I can ask him.
 
As for the enzymes denaturing, well many in this area do a RIMS approach all of the time with a false bottom and a pump. You just need to be judicious with the heat.
Yes, you will denature enzymes. I had a slew of beers I did with brew in a bag that wouldn't finish below 1.020, even with lots of healthy yeast, pure o2, and low mash temps. I would stir, but it wasn't enough, the heat on the bottom of the kettle was much warmer than what my thermometer near the top was reading... and now I know...
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Offline tonyccopeland

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2014, 11:34:22 AM »
I purchased a ~$4 Stainless Steel Steaming Rack stand to put in the bottom of my kettle to prevent burning of my bag.  I would just fish it out with the spoon once the grains were removed.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BGC7QBC/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2014, 01:25:04 PM »
If you don't heat your kettle during the mash you never have to worry about scorching. Insulating your kettle during the mash should help you keep your heat loss to an acceptable level.

If you're thinking of doing step mashes with BIAB, I think you're a lot better off doing it as a separate infusion. Directly heating your kettle during the mash can create hot spots. If you're worried about scorching your bag you should have the same concerns about the enzymes in your mash as well.
You can apply heat if the grains and bag are not close to the bottom of the kettle. I think the guy in the club recirculates while applying heat. If I make it to the club meeting on Friday I can ask him.
 
As for the enzymes denaturing, well many in this area do a RIMS approach all of the time with a false bottom and a pump. You just need to be judicious with the heat.
Yes, you will denature enzymes. I had a slew of beers I did with brew in a bag that wouldn't finish below 1.020, even with lots of healthy yeast, pure o2, and low mash temps. I would stir, but it wasn't enough, the heat on the bottom of the kettle was much warmer than what my thermometer near the top was reading... and now I know...

That is why the pump comes in handy. You pump from under the false bottom, and have the return coming back submerged in the grainbed. As I said, use judicious heat, not a blast. That way the wort does not get too hot. No problems with that system/technique. If you don't have a valve to drain/recirculate I do see issues.
Jeff Rankert
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Offline ynotbrusum

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Re: Burning your bag in BIAB?
« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2014, 04:11:00 PM »
Jeff - I've always wondered if you could run into the infamous HSA (mostly myth at the homebrew level I know, but with too much recirc in this way???). I may try a modified, hillbilly RIMS one of these days to see if there is a discernible difference, since I just did an ultra careful, no splash, rack to boil kettle to see if it results in any discernible difference.

BTW, I have a neighbor who does the drain and pour method while applying heat to a mash that is stepping up through steps or just being boosted to correct mash/mash out and he says he gets no problems doing it that way.  And his beers are really good, too.
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