[dmtaylor]

I dare you all to pour yourself 4 to 6 different examples, 3 of each style, and have a friend help you taste them all blind, and you declare which ones are "alt" and which are "Oktoberfest/maerzen".  Or, actually... how many altbiers have you all tasted in your lives??  I have never been to Germany.  I would guess that most other style nazis like me have not been there either.  So who is to say, really, what the differences are?  The BJCP??  I place about as much trust in the BJCP as..... well, maybe it's better than nothing.  Sometimes.  Maybe.

[majorvices]

I dare you all to pour yourself 4 to 6 different examples, 3 of each style, and have a friend help you taste them all blind, and you declare which ones are "alt" and which are "Oktoberfest/maerzen".  Or, actually... how many altbiers have you all tasted in your lives??  I have never been to Germany.  I would guess that most other style nazis like me have not been there either.  So who is to say, really, what the differences are?  The BJCP??  I place about as much trust in the BJCP as..... well, maybe it's better than nothing.  Sometimes.  Maybe.

I've tasted a few German alts in my time, and IMO I could pick it out in a blind taste test as easily as I could an IPA from a Tripel!

[HoosierBrew]

I think the bitterness alone in most alts would be out of place in any O-fest.

[majorvices]

I think the bitterness alone in most alts would be out of place in any O-fest.

Exactly my point!

[denny]

I dare you all to pour yourself 4 to 6 different examples, 3 of each style, and have a friend help you taste them all blind, and you declare which ones are "alt" and which are "Oktoberfest/maerzen".  Or, actually... how many altbiers have you all tasted in your lives??  I have never been to Germany.  I would guess that most other style nazis like me have not been there either.  So who is to say, really, what the differences are?  The BJCP??  I place about as much trust in the BJCP as..... well, maybe it's better than nothing.  Sometimes.  Maybe.

I'll take that dare....although I've never been to Germany, I've tatsed quite a few German alts and Ofests.

[beersk]

The thing to keep in mind is that in general it's only American versions of alt that include Munich.  That's very unlike Ofest.

Kai uses Munich:

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Kaiser_Alt

He's pretty German

I think the ones in Duesseldorf go from low/no Munich malt character (Uerige) to very evident (Schumacher).

Bitterness goes from medium to very high (Uerige).

Kai's looks like it would make a Schumacher or maybe closer would be Im Fuchschen.

Interesting. The last Uerige alt I had was very much like a Dunkel, with a slight bit more hop bitterness. Perhaps it was an old bottle.

[hopfenundmalz]

The thing to keep in mind is that in general it's only American versions of alt that include Munich.  That's very unlike Ofest.

Kai uses Munich:

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Kaiser_Alt

He's pretty German

I think the ones in Duesseldorf go from low/no Munich malt character (Uerige) to very evident (Schumacher).

Bitterness goes from medium to very high (Uerige).

Kai's looks like it would make a Schumacher or maybe closer would be Im Fuchschen.

Interesting. The last Uerige alt I had was very much like a Dunkel, with a slight bit more hop bitterness. Perhaps it was an old bottle.

The stated best by is short, 6 to 8 weeks IIRC. Yeah, the malt character changes.

[klickitat jim]

I can tell the difference between Alaskan Amber and Widmer Okto, even if you soak the labels off.

[Stevie]

I can tell the difference between Alaskan Amber and Widmer Okto, even if you soak the labels off.

I'm sure the fact that Alaskan uses short necks and Widmer uses embossed long necks doesn't hurt your odds.

[klickitat jim]

I can tell the difference between Alaskan Amber and Widmer Okto, even if you soak the labels off.

I'm sure the fact that Alaskan uses short necks and Widmer uses embossed long necks doesn't hurt your odds.

Dang it!