Author Topic: ball valve or butterfly valve  (Read 1023 times)

Offline Keith G

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 26
    • View Profile
ball valve or butterfly valve
« on: August 22, 2014, 05:27:41 PM »
I'm looking at adding a weldless fitting to my 10 gal tallboy kettle.  I've read that butterfly valve's are more sanitary, but ball valves offer better flow.  However, is it necessary to disassemble the valve every time you use it?  Couldn't you run PBW through the your kettle to clean the ball valve by opening it partway?

Another question is what size diameter valve/hoses are best for a valve from a kettle to the fermenter?  Is it recommended to use SS, brass, etc?

Any input is helpful.

Offline klickitat jim

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 4995
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2014, 05:33:11 PM »
Boil kettle?

Will you be whirlpooling?

I have a 15 gal boil kettle with a 1/2" stainess ball valve that I use a pump on to recirculate during cooling/whirlpool, ive never taken it apart and never had a problem. Of course every batch runs through it 15 min at least at a full boil...

Offline Steve in TX

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3036
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2014, 05:33:13 PM »
I use a stainless 1/2" ball valve with 1/2" fittings. I do not disassemble it and only clean it every so often.

Post brew kettle cleanup is a hose with a sprayer and I back flush the valve to clean anything out of it and the pickup tube. I store the kettle with the valve open to allow it to dry.

I wouldn't bother with a butterfly valve. At our scale it seems to me that it is a solution looking for a problem.

Offline hopfenundmalz

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 6178
  • Milford, MI
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2014, 05:39:50 PM »
The three piece ball valves that are sold by the likes of Blichmann can be disassembled and cleaned. Hot side I don't worry too much about, cold side (conical) those get more attention.

The commercial brewery that I have done a couple batches at has butterfly valves, those were brushed out, then soaked in acid sanitizer before putting on the fermenter with triclamps. Less places for critters to hide for sure.
Jeff Rankert
Ann Arbor Brewers Guild, AHA Member, BJCP Certified
Home-brewing, not just a hobby, it is a lifestyle!

Offline Keith G

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 26
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2014, 05:55:35 PM »
Boil kettle?

Will you be whirlpooling?

I have a 15 gal boil kettle with a 1/2" stainess ball valve that I use a pump on to recirculate during cooling/whirlpool, ive never taken it apart and never had a problem. Of course every batch runs through it 15 min at least at a full boil...

I'd like to whirlpool once I get a pump.  I'm not there yet, I'm just trying things that I can do fairly inexpensive and make my brew day much easier.  We have a machine shop where I work, so I have access to a machine shop, drill press, etc.

Sounds like 1/2" SS ball valve is the way to go.  Do you recommend a certain valve or can I get any type of 1/2" ball valve from a hardware store or Mcmaster carr?

Offline Steve in TX

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3036
    • View Profile
ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2014, 06:02:19 PM »
I buy most of my fittings from bargainfittings.com . The guy that runs the place is top notch.

Disclaimer - owner is also a member of a club I belong to. I ordered and was more than satisfied with his wares before I joined the club and met him.

Offline HoosierBrew

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 6442
  • Indianapolis,IN
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2014, 06:55:49 PM »
+1 to bargainfittings.com.  Great site. I bought the stuff for my last cooler conversion there (and stuff after).
Jon H.

Offline Thirsty_Monk

  • Brewmaster General
  • *******
  • Posts: 2186
  • Eau Claire WI
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2014, 07:08:45 PM »
Ball valve is just fine. No need to take it apart. Heat till do its job
Na Zdravie

On Tap At The TapRoom:
Bohemian Pilsner
Bohemian Dark Lager
Smoked Bock
MaiBock
American Brown Ale
Marzen
Root beer

Offline Slowbrew

  • Brewmaster General
  • *******
  • Posts: 2017
  • The Slowly Losing IT Brewery in Urbandale, IA
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2014, 04:04:59 AM »
Ball valve is just fine. No need to take it apart. Heat till do its job

I never worried about cleaning the ball valve on my boil kettle.  Then one day I took it apart "just to check" and it grossed me out so bad that I disassemble it every other brew day and clean it thoroughly. 

It may not cause any issues but once I saw the gunk in there I can' just leave it.  It's in the "trust but verify" category for me.

Paul
Where the heck are we going?  And what's with this hand basket?

Offline BrewBama

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 313
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2014, 04:07:37 AM »
I also have a ball valve from bargain fittings. I've never taken it apart but I might do that today just for a look see.
Huntsville AL

Offline AmandaK

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1427
  • Redbird Brewhouse
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2014, 07:26:59 AM »
Three piece ball on a boil kettle, but butterfly on the conical. For all the reasons stated above.
Amanda Burkemper
Kansas City Bier Meister; BJCP Master
Redbird Brewhouse - There's Always a Project
Our Homebrewed Wedding, AHA Article

Offline majorvices

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 7956
  • Polka. If its too loud you're too young.
    • View Profile
    • Yellowhammer Brewing Company
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2014, 08:15:37 AM »
I will be the big dissenter here. If you can afford butterfly valves go with them. They are much easier to clean and way more sanitary. I absolutely hate ball valves and the blickmann ones that disassemble are huge PITA to clean. With butterfly valves you open and soak me and rinse em and sanitize them and yer good to go.
Keith Y.

Vote Jonathan Fuller for Governing Committee!

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 13823
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2014, 08:26:30 AM »
I never worried about cleaning the ball valve on my boil kettle.  Then one day I took it apart "just to check" and it grossed me out so bad that I disassemble it every other brew day and clean it thoroughly. 

It may not cause any issues but once I saw the gunk in there I can' just leave it.  It's in the "trust but verify" category for me.

Paul

I take apart and clean it every 2-3 years, whether it needs it or not.  ;)
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

Offline realbeerguy

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 306
  • Golf & drink beer with your friends
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2014, 06:51:11 PM »
I will be the big dissenter here. If you can afford butterfly valves go with them. They are much easier to clean and way more sanitary. I absolutely hate ball valves and the blickmann ones that disassemble are huge PITA to clean. With butterfly valves you open and soak me and rinse em and sanitize them and yer good to go.

As I have said before, the only true sanitary valve is a butterfly or a diaphragm valve.  Media will get trapped behind the seat in the valve cavity.  With that said, the homebrew alternative is to get a 3-piece valve that you can disassemble and fully clean.  The downside to a bfv or diaphragm is that the seat is closse to the flame if you are using gas.  You must make sure that there is no EPDM or Viton in the seat or seals that may melt.  TFE is ok.
Member Savannah Brewers League & Lowcountry MALTS

Bluffton SC

Offline orangehero

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 15
    • View Profile
Re: ball valve or butterfly valve
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2014, 01:06:17 PM »
If you're using a weldless fitting, then sticking a butterfly valve on there would serve little benefit. As far as I know they don't sell butterfly valves with NPT threads for that very reason. You would have to go weldless to triclover, triclover to butterfly valve, then to triclover hose fitting.

If you do a CIP with recirculating PBW after you brew, opening ball valves half-way (and opening and closing them several times) will get them clean, no need for disassembly.

There are also sanitary fully encapsulated ball valves that prevent trapping liquid behind the ball.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2014, 01:11:17 PM by orangehero »