Author Topic: Dry yeast for English styles  (Read 10549 times)

Offline PORTERHAUS

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #30 on: December 09, 2015, 10:31:40 PM »
There's a whole thread on the Mangrove Jack yeasts.  I think the consensus was they weren't that great, but you'll have to read the thread.

Windsor is OK.  It tends to finish high.  I haven't used it recently, but I used it a fair amount in the past and liked it.  If you're going Windsor, mix it with Nottingham.  The mix makes both better.

I just looked for that since you mentioned it. Thanks. I searched the individual yeasts never tried searching Mangrove as a whole. But now you have me interested in that mix of Notty/Windsor. Are you talking a 50/50 mix?

Offline PORTERHAUS

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #31 on: December 09, 2015, 10:34:39 PM »
Bumping an old thread  but a great one. I am primarily a dry yeast user. Its cheap, easy and works for me with the basic brews I brew. I never know exactly when I will be brewing and for the beers I brew I havent noticed any better rrsults for the same strains in liquid form. I do use liquid for certain styles but I mosy brew everyday beers. There are a lot of new yeasts out there. Does anyone have any experience with the Mangrove Jack yeasts? I used the M07 British Ale once but dont really remember it. I have used S-04 and that is a go to yeast for me like US-05 is as well. Has anyone used the Mangrove Burton Union? It is said to be great for English Bitters which is the batch im brewing next. Then there is the Muntons Gold...I have never considered Muntons yeast but after reading through this thread it looks like the Muntons Gold can be something to try. Especially if its anything similar to the Fullers strain.
I also tried Windsor once in a Mild but I cant remember much about that one either. Another new dry yeast I am curious about is the Mangrove Newcastle yeast said to be great for dark beers...I considered it for a Bitter but it might be too much for that style unless someone can say otherwise.

So anyone have anything else to add about any of these yeasts?

I've found them to be pretty long laggers. Aside from that, they results have been mixed based on strain.

British Ale: did not like, too neutral, vodka-like esters (fusels?), better yeasts are available for this profile
Burton Union: excellent and unique british yeast, nutty quality, moderately fruity, great yeast
Newcastle Dark: yeast character is mild but pleasing, VERY LOW attenuator (mash in the 140s for sure)
US West Coast: excellent alternative to chico, more character than chico but subtle, more tart/tangy, very good
Belgian Ale: expect saison character, similar to belle saison but a little more subtle, good

That's my experience so far. I have Workhorse in my fridge but have read poor reports on it so I'm saving it for a special day :D

Thanks for sharring. Im intersted in trying the Burton Union for an English Bitter. I asko didnt care for the M07...too nuetral and finished very dry. Didnt leave much there.

Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #32 on: December 09, 2015, 10:57:35 PM »
There's a whole thread on the Mangrove Jack yeasts.  I think the consensus was they weren't that great, but you'll have to read the thread.

Windsor is OK.  It tends to finish high.  I haven't used it recently, but I used it a fair amount in the past and liked it.  If you're going Windsor, mix it with Nottingham.  The mix makes both better.

I just looked for that since you mentioned it. Thanks. I searched the individual yeasts never tried searching Mangrove as a whole. But now you have me interested in that mix of Notty/Windsor. Are you talking a 50/50 mix?

Yes.  Pretty much a 50/50.  I've pitched Windsor (or maybe Notty) after the other had a lag.  I'm pretty sure that was in a porter.  The mix was delicious.  I pitched the slurry into an old ale.  Same result.

Separately, I don't think they stand out and I don't care too much for Notty by itself.

A couple others on the forum have had the same experience.
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Offline Pricelessbrewing

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #33 on: December 10, 2015, 01:28:52 AM »
Interesting blend, I like the idea.

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #34 on: December 10, 2015, 01:31:38 AM »
The Nottingham/Windsor combo is good.  US-05 has a weird oxidized note to it that makes the strain only suitable for hoppy beers.  S-04 is probably my favorite dry yeast strain, but it can be temperamental.  While dry yeast has come a long way since the bad old days, I have yet to use a dry culture that performs as well as a properly handled cultured or liquid yeast culture.  I generally do not brew hoppy beers, so yeast character, good or bad, shines through the hops.

Offline Pricelessbrewing

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #35 on: December 10, 2015, 01:39:23 AM »
s-04 tips, suggestions? I haven't use it in about two years, but I have some on hand to use in an emergency (meant to grab s-05 but didn't pay attention and it was in the wrong bin)

Offline PORTERHAUS

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #36 on: December 10, 2015, 10:24:07 AM »
s-04 tips, suggestions? I haven't use it in about two years, but I have some on hand to use in an emergency (meant to grab s-05 but didn't pay attention and it was in the wrong bin)


S-04 is a great dry yeast (probably one of my favorite and most used next to US-05) but like mentioned it can be picky. In my experiences with it I like to use it around 66* for a few different styles. It ferments well and clears up right away. I have used it in Bitters, Browns and Porters. At mid 60's its clean but has some English character and its kind of "bready". At low 60's I think it can be too clean/nuetral for English styles but would work well at these temps for American styles. At warmer ale temps I have heard it gets quite estery or can have a tart flavor. But I haven't experiemented with it at lower or higher temps, mostly in the mid 60's with good results. I cant say I havent liked it in darker beers but I have liked it best in an English Bitter. I can have an Ordinary Bitter brewed, fermented, cleared and kegged a week later. I brewed an old school type of IPA over the summer and I almost used S-04, at lower 60's I think it would have been great.

Offline dilluh98

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #37 on: December 10, 2015, 12:19:16 PM »
s-04 tips, suggestions? I haven't use it in about two years, but I have some on hand to use in an emergency (meant to grab s-05 but didn't pay attention and it was in the wrong bin)


S-04 is a great dry yeast (probably one of my favorite and most used next to US-05) but like mentioned it can be picky. In my experiences with it I like to use it around 66* for a few different styles. It ferments well and clears up right away. I have used it in Bitters, Browns and Porters. At mid 60's its clean but has some English character and its kind of "bready". At low 60's I think it can be too clean/nuetral for English styles but would work well at these temps for American styles. At warmer ale temps I have heard it gets quite estery or can have a tart flavor. But I haven't experiemented with it at lower or higher temps, mostly in the mid 60's with good results. I cant say I havent liked it in darker beers but I have liked it best in an English Bitter. I can have an Ordinary Bitter brewed, fermented, cleared and kegged a week later. I brewed an old school type of IPA over the summer and I almost used S-04, at lower 60's I think it would have been great.

+1. Whitbread B behaves exactly this way for me. I have tried it in the upper 60s on a brown and did not like the results. I know some people like that extreme ester fruitiness (also some tart) in English styles but it doesn't do it for me generally.

Offline Iliff Ave Brewhouse

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #38 on: December 10, 2015, 02:23:34 PM »
s-04 tips, suggestions? I haven't use it in about two years, but I have some on hand to use in an emergency (meant to grab s-05 but didn't pay attention and it was in the wrong bin)


S-04 is a great dry yeast (probably one of my favorite and most used next to US-05) but like mentioned it can be picky. In my experiences with it I like to use it around 66* for a few different styles. It ferments well and clears up right away. I have used it in Bitters, Browns and Porters. At mid 60's its clean but has some English character and its kind of "bready". At low 60's I think it can be too clean/nuetral for English styles but would work well at these temps for American styles. At warmer ale temps I have heard it gets quite estery or can have a tart flavor. But I haven't experiemented with it at lower or higher temps, mostly in the mid 60's with good results. I cant say I havent liked it in darker beers but I have liked it best in an English Bitter. I can have an Ordinary Bitter brewed, fermented, cleared and kegged a week later. I brewed an old school type of IPA over the summer and I almost used S-04, at lower 60's I think it would have been great.

+1. Whitbread B behaves exactly this way for me. I have tried it in the upper 60s on a brown and did not like the results. I know some people like that extreme ester fruitiness (also some tart) in English styles but it doesn't do it for me generally.

I agree with this as well. In my experience, any thing at or above ~67-68F and it starts to add undesirable characteristics as evident in a recently wheat hybrid beer I did. When fermented cool, it is very clean and the English characteristics are much less obvious.
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Offline dilluh98

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #39 on: December 10, 2015, 02:35:11 PM »
All this being said - I really do love whitbread b. I'm going to have to do another cycle of beers with the fullers strain (WLP002) just as a reference point as I've been using WLP007 for so long now.

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #40 on: December 10, 2015, 02:37:48 PM »
I agree with this as well. In my experience, any thing at or above ~67-68F and it starts to add undesirable characteristics as evident in a recently wheat hybrid beer I did. When fermented cool, it is very clean and the English characteristics are much less obvious.


+1.  I use it on the cool end (63-64F) and it makes a clean beer with very faint ester.
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Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #41 on: December 10, 2015, 09:15:24 PM »
i used wlp007 for many brews when i started brewing. Great yeast that to me is like the equivalent of wlp090....works very fast, great attenuation on even high OG beers, drops clear, and depending on what you are brewing and want, you can ferment cooler (low 60s) to minimize esters or a little warmer (67-68) for nice ester contribution.  after about 48-60 hours you can start to bring that temp up if in the low 60's, and it will attenuate well.
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Offline dilluh98

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #42 on: December 10, 2015, 09:23:00 PM »
I love WLP090 for most APA and AIPAs - especially west-coast versions. You're right - they (007 and 090) do actually behave quite similarly.

Offline The Professor

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #43 on: December 11, 2015, 05:16:22 PM »
The Nottingham/Windsor combo is good.  US-05 has a weird oxidized note to it that makes the strain only suitable for hoppy beers.  S-04 is probably my favorite dry yeast strain, but it can be temperamental.  While dry yeast has come a long way since the bad old days, I have yet to use a dry culture that performs as well as a properly handled cultured or liquid yeast culture.  I generally do not brew hoppy beers, so yeast character, good or bad, shines through the hops.
Agree with all of the above, particularly the point about dry yeasts having been improved but still falling short of the quality from liquid cultures.  As far as favorites go, in recent months I've been brewing much more with the various variants/versions of Seibel BR97 and it has become my favorite in terms of performance, flavor, and ability to flocculate.  I've used the dry version of BRY97 a number of times, and it also seems to have the same characteristics as the wet versions.
Like many yeasts that have been co-opted with names suggesting American pedigree (such as 'West Coast Ale' and the like), it did originate in the UK.
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Offline coolman26

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Re: Dry yeast for English styles
« Reply #44 on: December 11, 2015, 10:25:43 PM »
i used wlp007 for many brews when i started brewing. Great yeast that to me is like the equivalent of wlp090....works very fast, great attenuation on even high OG beers, drops clear, and depending on what you are brewing and want, you can ferment cooler (low 60s) to minimize esters or a little warmer (67-68) for nice ester contribution.  after about 48-60 hours you can start to bring that temp up if in the low 60's, and it will attenuate well.

007 for me is top 2 ale yeasts I use.  007 and 1450 are my favorites.  I brewed an IPA and fermented at 64 and raised to 68.  The character of that yeast is fantastic IMO.  I'm on my last keg of it and can't get enough of it.  I just wish 1450 would flocculate like 007.
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