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Author Topic: less dry cider  (Read 9094 times)

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #30 on: January 11, 2015, 09:02:40 am »
so my apple juice was pretty sweet and low on tart. I decided to try something different and added 32oz of 100% tart cherry juice.  my OG was 1.061 and thinking I will rack often and keep around 57-60F so I end up around 1.010 and 6.7% ABV.
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
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http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

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Mead                 
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Offline gmac

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #31 on: January 12, 2015, 07:59:14 am »
How much sugar would you use for 5 gals of sparkling cider that was going to be bottled?
I force carbonate but someone asked me how much sugar to use.  I don't know if they are able to sorbate either but assuming so, I think it was a tsp per gal but please confirm that if you don't mind.
Thanks

Offline dmtaylor

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #32 on: January 12, 2015, 08:24:37 am »
Personally I prime mine the same as for beer, a half teaspoon per 12 oz or a full teaspoon for a bigger bottle, or 5/8 cup cane sugar per 5 gallons.  Things to keep in mind:

Natural carbonation of cider is always somewhat of a crapshoot, especially if you use sorbate and/or sulfite. 

In any case it always takes longer to carbonate than for beer, a month or two or even more.

You can use more priming sugar to help guarantee carbonation.  However, gushers and bottle bombs remain a distinct possibility.

Even if you do everything right, often times it might turn out flat or just a slight hiss when you pop the top, even after months.

Forced carb is probably best.

On the other hand, flat cider tastes every bit as good as the carbonated stuff.  Cider is much more like a wine than beer.

Don't expect your finished cider to taste like Angry Orchard or Woodchuck.  The vast majority of homemade ciders do not taste anything like the mass commercial ciders.  And they shouldn't.  They make their ciders from concentrate.  We don't have to, we're not trying to compete with beer drinkers.
Dave

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Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #33 on: January 13, 2015, 07:42:25 am »
any need for sulfites in cider like they use in wine?
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline dmtaylor

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #34 on: January 13, 2015, 08:25:32 am »
Only if you backsweeten a lot.  Typically I don't use any sulfites anymore.  It's really not necessary unless you backsweeten a lot and need to prevent bombs.  No backsweeten, no sulfites required.
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #35 on: January 13, 2015, 08:31:43 am »
I usually backsweeten and sulfite, but the cider I have on tap now is even colder than kegerator temps with the arctic weather lately (kegerator in garage), so I didn't bother.  And the cider typically (being ~ 5.5% abv) doesn't last long, so if it's cold enough and doesn't last long, you really don't need to. If I bottled I would sulfite, however.
Jon H.

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #36 on: January 13, 2015, 08:52:51 am »
yeah my question on sulfites was about preservation for long term consumption, not so much on halting fermentation. sounds like I really don't need it
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline dmtaylor

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #37 on: January 13, 2015, 09:00:47 am »
No, you don't need it.  It will last for a very long time without sulfites.  Years.  The only trouble I ever had was with a really weak cider where the OG was only like 1.042, then I had some odd staleness kind of a thing after a year in the bottle.  But that was the only time.
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #38 on: January 15, 2015, 07:27:32 pm »
So what would you do? My cider has been going for 5 days at 60F. Started 1.061 and just took reading and its 1.014. Tastes great. Really surprised how quickly this progressed with cote des blancs. Anyway, I'm thinking I should rack now and get it even cooler- 50's. A little sweet at 1.014- thinking around 1.008-.010 is where I want to end up.
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline dmtaylor

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #39 on: January 15, 2015, 08:13:44 pm »
Rack it right away and cool it down.  Then keep an eye on it.  If gravity continues to fall too fast in a few more days, slam it with gelatin, rack again, and put it in the fridge and leave it there for a month.
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #40 on: January 15, 2015, 08:17:40 pm »

Rack it right away and cool it down.  Then keep an eye on it.  If gravity continues to fall too fast in a few more days, slam it with gelatin, rack again, and put it in the fridge and leave it there for a month.

Is this normal for this yeast to move so fast? I mean I guess it kind of is for wine or champagne yeast. I just did a wine kit with premier cuvée and in 7 days at 68f it was down to 1.008.


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Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #41 on: January 16, 2015, 09:39:23 am »
I like the idea of notti as the yeast. My experience with it suggests it will still finish somewhat dry and I will need to back sweeten to get back to 1.008. Unless it's behaves differently with apple juice......Dave says rack weekly...is this necessary?


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Dave's was a list of things to do to get a sweeter cider by using the right yeast and fermentation management to get there. I've done it - works fine.  The way I've been making cider for a while is to leave in primary for over month, let it ferment out, rack to secondary, and eventually backsweeten and acidify to my tastes, as mentioned. Lots of approaches and room to experiment !

anyway, i was thinking of racking and cooling to slow it down and try to manage FG into desired range of 1.008-.010.

but that got me thinking..not letting it finish, does that leave you open to any off flavors that the yeast might normally clean up? tastes pretyy dam good right now-just a bit sweeter than i want.
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #42 on: January 16, 2015, 09:47:46 am »

but that got me thinking..not letting it finish, does that leave you open to any off flavors that the yeast might normally clean up? tastes pretyy dam good right now-just a bit sweeter than i want.

Not that I ever noticed. I probably did it that way 4 or 5 times before I started letting it ferment dry, and the cider was good each time. For me and my hectic schedule it's just a lot easier to pitch, let it go to .998 or wherever it wants to finish at, rack to secondary and leave it there until I'm ready to keg. Then back sweeten and acidify, and serve.
Jon H.

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #43 on: January 16, 2015, 09:50:28 am »
ok thanks-figured if it tasted good now i'd be ok by slowing/halting. i'm just used to making and drinking pretty dry cider. this will be the first one with residual sweetness to it.

FWIW, that 32oz of tart cherry juice really gave it the tartness i was looking for without adding any acid.
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: less dry cider
« Reply #44 on: January 16, 2015, 09:52:28 am »


FWIW, that 32oz of tart cherry juice really gave it the tartness i was looking for without adding any acid.

Yeah, I'm not surprised. The sour cherry concentrate I use in my wife's cherry beer is very tart.  You should be good on acid, easily.
Jon H.