Author Topic: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison  (Read 5276 times)

Offline unclebrazzie

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Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« on: December 12, 2014, 09:15:25 AM »
Hi folks!

I'm planning to brew a saison again sometime soon, but I'd rather not use Danstar/Lallemand's Belle Saison for reasons of de gustibus.
Can anyone recommend a Fermentis/Safale yeast which my saison could benefit from? I reckon T-58 sounds about right but can't recall it displaying anything "saisonesque" (only used it once to my recollection). S-33 sounds more general purpose but perhaps if I give it a warmer saisony temperature profile...

I know I could also harvest proper saison from a bottle of Dupont (saison or Moinette) but I'm specifically looking for dried yeast here. Lazy, and not terribly apt at making starters, is all.

Thanks in advance!
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Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2014, 01:33:43 PM »
S-33 will NOT get you there, that's the old Edme yeast which is an English strain.  Does not taste Belgiany at all.

I bet a 50/50 combination of T-58 and the new Abbaye dry yeast will get you close.  Both of those are supposed to taste dry and Belgiany, and the Abbaye yeast is supposed to attenuate more than 90% especially if sugars are added.

If you do try this, let us know how it turns out!
Dave

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Offline unclebrazzie

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2014, 08:02:49 AM »
S-33 will NOT get you there, that's the old Edme yeast which is an English strain.  Does not taste Belgiany at all.
I hear you. Just found that info as well. I've brewed with S-33 once before but can't recall it standing out.

T-58 on the other hand was, until I met Belle Saison, the most pronounced dry yeast I brewed with. Not necessarily in a good way, but then I've only recently started to control my fermentation temp.

I bet a 50/50 combination of T-58 and the new Abbaye dry yeast will get you close.  Both of those are supposed to taste dry and Belgiany, and the Abbaye yeast is supposed to attenuate more than 90% especially if sugars are added.

I've heard Abbaye being mentioned for saisons before (can't recalle where though) which strikes me as weird. Then again: it's a saison so "anything goes" as far as I'm concerned. A banana-estery saison, why not? :)
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Offline goschman

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2014, 02:27:39 PM »
I attempted a crabapple saison with T58 recently after I had read others recommend it. It ended up being a good beer but I would recognize as something closer to a blond. T58 works great for Wits but I would not try another saison with it and would probably use a proper 'saison' yeast. You might be able to get close with the addition of spices, zest, etc...

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Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2014, 02:28:30 PM »
If it tastes like banana at all, just give it time.  Banana usually fades after a few months of age.
Dave

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Offline reverseapachemaster

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2014, 04:37:59 PM »
There's not a great dry saison yeast out there. Belle is the only strain marketed as a saison yeast in the dry category. I haven't used it but many people do not seem overly impressed by it. I've used T-58 once (not in a saison) and I agree with the consensus that it is characteristically similar to a wit strain or maybe a spice-forward abbey strain.

If I had to use a dry yeast I would use T-58 fermented as warm as the strain permits and strongly contemplate adding some spices/fruit peels/etc. that would round out the fruity ester profile you want in a saison yeast. I'd stay away from coriander and orange peel as that is more of a wit flavor combinations.
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Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2014, 05:24:27 PM »
I used T-58 in a small saison a year or so ago.  Probably 1.05 or so to start.  Fermented around 68 tops for ambient temp.

I thought it came out well.  I don't recall specifics.  Served it at a party and it was well received.
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Offline erockrph

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #7 on: December 15, 2014, 06:15:46 PM »
If I had to use a dry yeast I would use T-58 fermented as warm as the strain permits and strongly contemplate adding some spices/fruit peels/etc. that would round out the fruity ester profile you want in a saison yeast. I'd stay away from coriander and orange peel as that is more of a wit flavor combinations.
Ommegang does something similar with Hennepin. They use their house yeast and add spices. It's a lot closer to a saison than if there were no spices. But it still ends up tasting like a spiced Belgian blonde ale to me, rather than a saison.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2014, 06:18:09 PM »

But it still ends up tasting like a spiced Belgian blonde ale to me, rather than a saison.

I agree. I've had a lot of Hennepin and still enjoy it. But it's not real saison-like IMO.
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Offline unclebrazzie

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #9 on: December 16, 2014, 08:58:15 AM »
Thx folks!

Looks like I'll be using a starter of either a second-generation liquid saison yeast, or else grab a bottle of Dupont after all :)
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Offline Steve Ruch

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Re: Fermentis/Safale dried yeast and saison
« Reply #10 on: December 19, 2014, 12:52:49 AM »
S-33 will NOT get you there, that's the old Edme yeast which is an English strain.  Does not taste Belgiany at all.
I hear you. Just found that info as well. I've brewed with S-33 once before but can't recall it standing out.

I recently brewed an APA with a S-33/Munton's blend (both were way past best by date) that turned out great. Right now I have a rye porter going using just the S-33.
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