Author Topic: Sparging Water Volume  (Read 1611 times)

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2015, 01:40:53 AM »
Jeff, you raise an ominous specter. Now I'm going to have to do some cross-checking on my refractometer too. As mentioned, this may be more reason to end the runoff earlier.

Extra testing for the next brew.

Once you calibrate the refract and know its reading correctly. I also test it against my hydrometer at the proper temp and they are usually spot on. Good luck!1

Have you done a serial dilution of a known Brix to make sure it is linear at low Brix? The old one had been dropped and abused several times, but last I checked was fine at 15 Brix. Didn't take it down to 1 to 4 Brix.

Some will say putting water on and setting to zero is calibrating. That is zeroing, but what about slope and linearity?
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2015, 01:43:25 AM »
Jeff, you raise an ominous specter. Now I'm going to have to do some cross-checking on my refractometer too. As mentioned, this may be more reason to end the runoff earlier.

Extra testing for the next brew.

You did point out a little astringency on my German Pilsner that got a Bronze at the 2011 NHC. It was noticed when I sat down and read the scoring. I have been chasing it for a long time, maybe now I have a clue!
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Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2015, 05:04:04 PM »
Jeff, you raise an ominous specter. Now I'm going to have to do some cross-checking on my refractometer too. As mentioned, this may be more reason to end the runoff earlier.

Extra testing for the next brew.

You did point out a little astringency on my German Pilsner that got a Bronze at the 2011 NHC. It was noticed when I sat down and read the scoring. I have been chasing it for a long time, maybe now I have a clue!

Jeff- do you also fly sparge?
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Offline denny

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2015, 05:20:20 PM »
Look, I know this is kinda a radical suggestion, but why not try batch sparging to possibly \alleviate those problems?  At least to me, it seems so obvious.
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Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #19 on: January 05, 2015, 05:34:50 PM »
Look, I know this is kinda a radical suggestion, but why not try batch sparging to possibly \alleviate those problems?  At least to me, it seems so obvious.

well you were more direct than i was Denny. I was just asking if Jeff also was a fly sparge guy like Martin.

I have no experience with fly sparge, but I can say 100% that I've not had one issue with tannin extraction utilizing the batch sparge method.
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
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https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

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Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2015, 05:49:13 PM »
Look, I know this is kinda a radical suggestion, but why not try batch sparging to possibly \alleviate those problems?  At least to me, it seems so obvious.
Jeff, you raise an ominous specter. Now I'm going to have to do some cross-checking on my refractometer too. As mentioned, this may be more reason to end the runoff earlier.

Extra testing for the next brew.

You did point out a little astringency on my German Pilsner that got a Bronze at the 2011 NHC. It was noticed when I sat down and read the scoring. I have been chasing it for a long time, maybe now I have a clue!

Jeff- do you also fly sparge?

For this beer I was doing a step mash using the direct fired kettle, following the Devil's Backbone recipe from this year's NHC.

Denny, for your personal gratification, I now have a Blue 70qt. coleman extreme for single infusions. More volume for big beers. Someday I might try bumping the temp on that using a grant (5 gallon kettle with a ball valve, pump back in to the mash).

I don't have astringency problems on big beers in the kettle, as the gravity does not get that low.

It had to be something giving the astringency, maybe I have now found it.
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Offline denny

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2015, 06:49:10 PM »
I don't have astringency problems on big beers in the kettle, as the gravity does not get that low.

It had to be something giving the astringency, maybe I have now found it.

Ah hah, I get it now.  How small a beer do you have to make to have astringency issues?
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2015, 07:57:56 PM »
I don't have astringency problems on big beers in the kettle, as the gravity does not get that low.

It had to be something giving the astringency, maybe I have now found it.

Ah hah, I get it now.  How small a beer do you have to make to have astringency issues?

1.048-ish and down. Small for you!  8)

The strategy for doing step mashes in the future in that kettle is to set the recipe efficiency lower, get the points I need in the kettle and top up with water if need be. There will be sugars left in the mash, but that will be drained and used for starters.

A little calibration run on the old and new hydrometers is in order.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2015, 08:30:31 PM by denny »
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Offline brewday

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #23 on: January 05, 2015, 08:19:16 PM »

Denny, for your personal gratification, I now have a Blue 70qt. coleman extreme for single infusions.

FWIW I've done several three-step infusion mashes in that 70qt blue cooler. No mash out/no sparge.

Offline denny

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #24 on: January 05, 2015, 08:31:25 PM »
I don't have astringency problems on big beers in the kettle, as the gravity does not get that low.

It had to be something giving the astringency, maybe I have now found it.

Ah hah, I get it now.  How small a beer do you have to make to have astringency issues?

1.048-ish and down. Small for you!  8)

The strategy for doing step mashes in the future in that kettle is to set the recipe efficiency lower, get the points I need in the kettle and top up with water if need be. There will be sugars left in the mash, but that will be drained and used for starters.

A little calibration run on the old and new hydrometers is in order.

I noticed some astringency in my American mild attempts, despite doing a no sparge.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #25 on: January 05, 2015, 09:21:50 PM »

Denny, for your personal gratification, I now have a Blue 70qt. coleman extreme for single infusions.

FWIW I've done several three-step infusion mashes in that 70qt blue cooler. No mash out/no sparge.
I know, a friend does decoctions to step in his 10 gallon cooler when there's no more room for infusions. Lots of ways to do it.
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Offline Black Sands Brewery & Supply

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #26 on: January 08, 2015, 06:49:24 AM »
hey guys here is that equation i was talking about earlier in this thread.

current kettle volume (bbls) x current gravity / target pre-boil volume = qty of H20 to add to get desired pre-boil gravity in bbls.

example: 12 bbls x 5 (plato) / 17.5 (bbls) = 3.4 bbls of h20

or keep running off from mash and running equation very bbl added.

i'm working on how to convert this to smaller volume for homebrew size batches.
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Offline chumley

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #27 on: January 08, 2015, 05:40:11 PM »
This thread helps explain all my beers below 1.045 OG taste like crap, and why I quit brewing them.

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #28 on: January 09, 2015, 12:45:53 AM »

This thread helps explain all my beers below 1.045 OG taste like crap, and why I quit brewing them.

Yeah but it's not the gravity that causes this, it's the process. I make low OG beers with no issues...... I'm a mash cooler and batch sparge brewer.


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Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline quattlebaum

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Re: Sparging Water Volume
« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2015, 01:26:02 PM »

Have you tried to go a bit lower on your limit, say 1.008? and see if you notice it.  By all means i know i shouldnt ask you especially:) but from my understanding two things result in tannin extraction high PH and high temp.  So if PH is 5.2ish and temps are good maybe one may not have to worry as much about tannin extraction?

I say this because i had the same issue with my EHERMS, seemed to be extracting all the sugars prior to sparge and always ended up short. it was very frustrating so i just sparged anyways to 1.008. No one including myself notice off flavors related to tannin/Husky extraction (pilsners).

If that is working for you then don't change anything.

Well I think I really need to pay better attention. I really don't enter companions much and there is to much room for error with my and my homebrew clubs palate. 


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