Author Topic: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice  (Read 1932 times)

Offline mchrispen

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Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« on: January 04, 2015, 01:42:18 AM »
Love English Barleywines... Some American ones... Haven't brewed one yet.

Thinking a 10 gallon batch.

40% GW 2-Row
50% Crisp MO

The rest perhaps some wheat and biscuit? Less than 10%?

Heading towards about 60 IBU bittering with Magnum

What about late hops? I have a lb of Styrian Goldings, but can get something else.

Might add a small bit of bochet'd honey for some caramel and marshmallow tones into the fermenter. Will bulk age for at least 6 months.

Oh, and yeast. Leaning towards something estery like West Yorkshire...

Thoughts? Too complicated?




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Offline kmccaf

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2015, 02:04:41 AM »
I would skip the wheat and biscuit, and do it 50/50 of 2 row and MO. Adding the bochet honey sounds like a good idea. I really like stryrian goldings as a late hop in a barley wine, and it goes very well with 1469 West Yorkshire. In fact, this sounds a lot like a barley wine I made a few years ago. I say do it, and go crazy with the Stryian Goldings in the late additions. It's a nice dry hop as well.
Kyle M.

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2015, 02:12:08 AM »
Love English Barleywines... Some American ones... Haven't brewed one yet.

Thinking a 10 gallon batch.

40% GW 2-Row
50% Crisp MO

The rest perhaps some wheat and biscuit? Less than 10%?

Heading towards about 60 IBU bittering with Magnum

What about late hops? I have a lb of Styrian Goldings, but can get something else.

Might add a small bit of bochet'd honey for some caramel and marshmallow tones into the fermenter. Will bulk age for at least 6 months.

Oh, and yeast. Leaning towards something estery like West Yorkshire...

Thoughts? Too complicated?




Matt Chrispen
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I find MO to have biscuity character as is, so I don't think you'd need the biscuit. Wouldn't hurt either, though. Maybe 5% C60? I've made several BW without any crystal and loved them, but some C60 can be good - I wouldn't use more than 5%, personally. Past that, lots of 02/oxygenation, low mash temp ( I like 148F for 90 minutes for barleywine). Never used 1469 for BW, but being really flocculant, I'd be sure to ramp up and even rouse at the end, to keep from having it floc out early. As for hops, EKG late is always good for English BW. I think it'll be good !
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Offline fmader

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2015, 02:31:15 AM »
I went...
9.5 lb (38%) Two Row
9.5 lb (38%) Maris Otter
5.25 lb (20%) Munich
1 lb (4%) Victory

90 minute mash at 148 and 90 minute boil.

5.5 gallon batch

I hit about 60% efficiency to reach my target OG of 1.100.

It was an American BW so a bit more hopped. If I were to brew again, I wouldn't change a thing with the grain bill. This beer exceeded my expectations by far. I just used WLP 001 yeast and started fermentation at 60 for about a week. I slowly let it rise to the low 70s. It fermented for 38 days. I kegged and stashed it in the closet for 9 months.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2015, 02:35:08 AM by fmader »
Frank

Offline mchrispen

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2015, 05:42:13 PM »
How about blending in some Golden Promise (Simpsons) with the Maris Otter (Crisp)? Haven't brewed with GP yet, but bought a bag over the holiday. The description seems more mellow than Maris. Dropping my efficiency about 10 points as well.


Will also use a bit of Medium Crystal (Simpsons) as well.


10.5 gallons


18# 2-Row (GW)
10# MO (Crisp)
8# GP (Simpsons)
1.5# Medium Crystal (Simpsons)


Mash low at 148F, mash out.


50g Magnum (FW)
100g Styrians at 15
100g Styrians at 5


Let that stand for about 15 minutes


Dry Hop with Styrians for a week before packaging.


Will repitch slurry off a mild, about 760b cells. Will count to make sure I have a good pitch.


Keep the Golden Promise?
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Offline kmccaf

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2015, 06:07:31 PM »
I think some Golden Promise would be a good blend in the base. I would just use the Magnum to bitter personally instead of first wort, and would probably use some of the Goldings to bitter as well. I've made English Barleywines with and without crystal malt, and prefer it without, but not by a ton. Otherwise, sounds good to me. Let us know how it turns out!
Kyle M.

Offline erockrph

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2015, 08:45:12 PM »
100% base malt and a big pitch of English Yeast are all you need for an English Barleywine. Time and a high enough FG will give you all the caramel/raisin flavors you need.

I've used all MO, as well as a combo of MO and Pils for English BW's with great success. The combo of MO and GP should be nice as well.
Eric B.

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Offline mabrungard

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2015, 09:37:26 PM »
I love GP! I would go with some combination of GP and MO. I don't think you need any other body builders like wheat, but a teeny bit of flavor malts might be interesting. I agree that a long and low mash is desirable to boost the fermentability as much as possible to keep the beer from being a syrupy malt bomb. I like 146F for 90 min.
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2015, 10:27:55 PM »
Simpson's GP has a malty sweet taste as it is about 2.0L. Thomas Fawcett GP is around 3.5L and has a little more of the toasty malty taste.

I think GP and MO work well together in an English Barleywine. The one that I brewed last June used those, along with a little NA 2 row, as I was a little low on the MO and GP.
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Offline mchrispen

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2015, 01:26:41 AM »
Now I am getting excited.  Should be interesting to see how this goes. Looking forward to putting down some of this for a long age.

Still have to let my mild finish... I did it open ferment(ish) - and manually roused the yeast from the bottom of the conical. Will crash it soon. It's incredibly fruity right now... And needs to shave another couple of points. Hopefully enough yeast harvest for both the Barleywine and a riggwelter clone.

Will rework the recipe again.

Thinking "pale malty" water profile.


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Offline morticaixavier

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2015, 04:23:43 PM »
sounds good. +1 to all the suggestions to keep it simple with base malt and little or nothing else. a touch of crystal, like .5 lb tops.
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Offline yso191

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2015, 04:55:51 PM »
If I may take this thread a few degrees off...

I have never brewed a Barleywine, but drinking Avery's Hog Heaven recently has me wanting to.  So given the above counsel regarding an English BW, how would the grain bill be adjusted for an American BW?  Or would it? 

In particular the thing I loved about Hog Heaven is the wonderful hop flavors which were in my opinion the perfect compliment to this style.
Steve
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Offline morticaixavier

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2015, 05:10:37 PM »
If I may take this thread a few degrees off...

I have never brewed a Barleywine, but drinking Avery's Hog Heaven recently has me wanting to.  So given the above counsel regarding an English BW, how would the grain bill be adjusted for an American BW?  Or would it? 

In particular the thing I loved about Hog Heaven is the wonderful hop flavors which were in my opinion the perfect compliment to this style.

my feeling on american barley wine is it's all about the hops. once you age an american barley wine a year or more it basically turns into an english barley wine. so late hops and a neutral yeast. The difference between an american barley wine and an IIPA is the body and maltiness so skip any simple sugar additions as well. an all MO barley wine with us-05 and a really nice late hop character but with a really bracing bitterness sounds about right.
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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2015, 05:17:46 PM »
If I may take this thread a few degrees off...

I have never brewed a Barleywine, but drinking Avery's Hog Heaven recently has me wanting to.  So given the above counsel regarding an English BW, how would the grain bill be adjusted for an American BW?  Or would it? 

In particular the thing I loved about Hog Heaven is the wonderful hop flavors which were in my opinion the perfect compliment to this style.

This recipe took gold at the OR State Fair comp, as well as a couple others....

Old Stoner 10

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (Gal):        11.00    Wort Size (Gal):   11.00
Total Grain (Lbs):       61.50
Anticipated OG:          1.111    Plato:             26.11
Anticipated SRM:          20.7
Anticipated IBU:         114.9
Brewhouse Efficiency:       56 %
Wort Boil Time:             70    Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate:       1.50    Gallons Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size:   12.75    Gal
Pre-Boil Gravity:      1.096    SG          22.80  Plato


Grain/Extract/Sugar

   %     Amount     Name                          Origin        Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 66.7    41.00 lbs. Pale Ale Malt (2 Row)         France         1.039      2
 24.4    15.00 lbs. Munich Malt Great Western (2- America        1.035     10
  4.9     3.00 lbs. CaraMunich 80                 France         1.034     40
  4.1     2.50 lbs. Crystal 60L                   America        1.034     60

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

   Amount     Name                              Form    Alpha  IBU  Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  5.00 oz.    Zeus 2008                         Whole   16.40  33.9  First WH
  7.00 oz.    Centennial (Kevin)                Pellet   8.30  73.1  60 min.
  2.00 oz.    Amarillo 2008                     Whole    9.50   7.9  10 min.
  2.00 oz.    Centennial (Kevin)                Pellet   8.30   0.0  Dry Hop


Extras

  Amount      Name                           Type      Time
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
  1.00 Tsp    Yeast Nutrient                 Other     10 Min.(boil)
  2.00 Tsp    Gypsum                         Other     60 Min.(boil)
  1.00 Unit(s)Whirlfolc                      Fining    15 Min.(boil)


Yeast
-----

Wyeast 1450 Denny's Favorite


Mash Schedule
-------------

Mash Name:

Total Grain Lbs:   61.50
Total Water Qts:   88.00 - Before Additional Infusions
Total Water Gal:   22.00 - Before Additional Infusions

Tun Thermal Mass:   0.13
Grain Temp:        62.00 F


                     Step   Rest   Start   Stop  Heat     Infuse   Infuse  Infuse
Step Name            Time   Time   Temp    Temp  Type     Temp     Amount  Ratio
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
sacc                   0     60    152     152   Infuse   168       88.00   1.43


Total Water Qts:           88.00 - After Additional Infusions
Total Water Gal:           22.00 - After Additional Infusions
Total Mash Volume Gal:     26.92 - After Additional Infusions

All temperature measurements are degrees Fahrenheit.
All infusion amounts are in Quarts.
All infusion ratios are Quarts/Lbs.


Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline yso191

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Re: Thoughts on a barley wine... Need advice
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2015, 07:08:51 PM »
Thank you!
Steve
All Hands Brewing
BJCP #D1667