Author Topic: Bock attenuation problem  (Read 1573 times)

Offline 69franx

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Bock attenuation problem
« on: January 04, 2015, 10:16:03 PM »
Hey all, I'm back from Florida. I just checked my Bock brewed on 12/7/14 and it is down to 1.025 from 1.072, or 65% attenuation with WLP833, pitched around 540B cells estimated when Beersmith called for 552B. When I left town, I gave it the last 2 degree bump to get it to 65DF and it was at 1.029 (60% attenuation at that point) it has been resting at 65 for 10 days and has only gone down another 4 points. My grist was 50/50 Munich I&II with 3 oz carafa II to get the color right. Mashed at 155, projection of 1.02 FG, really not even close right now. Its my first attempt at a Bock and the sample tastes good, if a bit sweet. The only yeast I have on hand currently is a pack of S04. Not sure if it is just done high due to mash temp? Or if I can get a couple more points out of it. Its roughly 6.2% ABV right now, a little low but drinkable. Any suggestions?
Frank L.
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In the works: Hopefully brewing 10 gallons of Pilsner tomorrow for a family reunion in July, then back to IPA and  a barleywine to age

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2015, 11:24:21 PM »
Push it up to 68-70 and rouse yeast?

Offline 69franx

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2015, 11:25:35 PM »
I can try that, fingers crossed
Frank L.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2015, 11:34:53 PM »
Push it up to 68-70 and rouse yeast?

Yep, it should help the yeast eat a few points, hopefully.
Jon H.

Offline quattlebaum

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2015, 01:02:01 AM »
shoot that sucks! wonder if you got full conversion with mostly Munich and a high mash temp? Dont think re pitching will help unfortunately. ill keep my fingers crossed :)

Offline 69franx

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2015, 01:23:59 AM »
Yes, I am liking the taste so when I re-brew it, I think I will mash lower with the same grist. My pre-boil grav and volume were right on with proj, as was OG and volume, so I am leaning towards too high mash temp or under pitching, but I thought my pitch was good after reading several posts on here from S. cerevisae about just needing to be close, and not off by a magnitude... you know what I mean
Frank L.
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In the works: Hopefully brewing 10 gallons of Pilsner tomorrow for a family reunion in July, then back to IPA and  a barleywine to age

Offline majorvices

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2015, 01:51:52 AM »
When you have problems like this it will make you wonder if you really pitched enough yeast? Did you aerate long enough? You might try subbing a couple pounds of pils next time and mashing a little lower and a little longer. It's frustrating but you'll start finding the tricks that work.

Offline majorvices

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2015, 02:00:31 AM »
My grist was 50/50 Munich I&II with 3 oz carafa II to get the color right. Mashed at 155, projection of 1.02 FG,

Well, here's your problem right here. you probably mashed too high. I wouldn't have mashed higher that 152. In fact, 148 would not have been too low. And a couple pound of pils malt will help insure that you have the enzymes necessary to compete conversion and dry your beer down where you really want it.

Too many brewers make the mistake in thinking "more body, more better" - these beers have plenty of body. The trick isn't getting them to have enough body. It's getting them dry enough so that when you finish the first beer, you really want a second. That's really the key with every beer. And rarely is there ever a reason to mash at 155.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2015, 02:39:17 AM by majorvices »

Offline 69franx

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2015, 05:02:40 AM »
Thanks again. I figured it was likely mash temp and lack of fermentability it caused, since OG was on. Next time I'll go with 150/152. I have heard about enzyme issues but I'm sure I read here that both Munichs  will self convert but type 2 may be difficult. I was just running g with an idea I saw here a while back to do all Munich. I can add some pils on next attempt. It's sitting at 69 now and I gave bucket a bit of rousing to see what the yeast have  left in them. I'll know better next weekend.
Frank L.
Fermenting:
Conditioning:
In keg:
In Bottles:  
In the works: Hopefully brewing 10 gallons of Pilsner tomorrow for a family reunion in July, then back to IPA and  a barleywine to age

Offline majorvices

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2015, 12:08:56 PM »
Theoretically they have enough to convert themselves, and I know the general consensus on the forum is you don't need pils. I just find it makes a better beer for my tastes to add a little pils, especially if the gravity is higher. It's just a little tool to keep in mind.

Regardless, in spite the higher finishing OG from what you want I'm sure it's still a good, drinkable beer!

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2015, 02:50:38 PM »
I have a nearly 100% Munich dunkel coming up (next brew day). This made me rethink my mash temp. Think I'll go with 148° for 90 min and erring on the low side.instead of 152. Not much difference but it can't hurt.

Offline AmandaK

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2015, 04:58:52 PM »
I've brewed a good number of gallons of 100% Best Malz Munich II dunkel, mashing at 154F, pitching WY2206, and FG of 1.012.

I get that everyone's system is different, but I don't treat Munich I or II much different than any other malt. Are you guys using a different maltster or something?
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Offline jeffy

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2015, 06:01:04 PM »
I just made a Munich II Dunkel yesterday with a little Carafa II for color and pitched a whole lot of think 2206 into it. I mashed in at about 150 and then settled at 154 after stirring and recirculating.  We'll see how it attenuates.
By the way, all the malt was cold smoked over citrus and pecan wood chips.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2015, 06:27:24 PM »
I just made a Munich II Dunkel yesterday with a little Carafa II for color and pitched a whole lot of think 2206 into it. I mashed in at about 150 and then settled at 154 after stirring and recirculating.  We'll see how it attenuates.
By the way, all the malt was cold smoked over citrus and pecan wood chips.

That sounds really good.  I've used a lot of different wood, mostly for BBQ (including pecan), but never citrus.
Jon H.

Offline jeffy

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Re: Bock attenuation problem
« Reply #14 on: January 06, 2015, 01:59:34 AM »
I just made a Munich II Dunkel yesterday with a little Carafa II for color and pitched a whole lot of think 2206 into it. I mashed in at about 150 and then settled at 154 after stirring and recirculating.  We'll see how it attenuates.
By the way, all the malt was cold smoked over citrus and pecan wood chips.

That sounds really good.  I've used a lot of different wood, mostly for BBQ (including pecan), but never citrus.
Citrus makes a very clean smoke flavor, similar to beach wood.  It lacks the sweetness of some of the popular fruit tree woods.
Jeff Gladish, Tampa (989.3, 175.1 Apparent Rennarian)
Homebrewing since 1990
AHA member since 1991, now a lifetime member
BJCP judge since 1995