Author Topic: Thoughts on my ESB recipe  (Read 1831 times)

Offline jackwhite

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Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« on: January 25, 2015, 12:08:15 AM »
Batch Size: 5.0 gal   
Style: ESB
Boil Size: 6.75 gal
Color: 14 SRM   
Bitterness: 50+ IBUs   
Boil Time: 90 min
Est OG: 1.058
Est FG: 1.014
ABV: 5.4%   
Mash 75 @ 154

10.25 lbs Maris Otter
12 oz Crisp Crystal 77L
2 oz Chocolate Malt 380L

0.88 oz Challenger [6.0%] First Wort Hop
0.88 oz US Goldings [4.0%] FWH

0.25 oz Magnum [10.0%] 60.o min

0.88 oz Challenger [6.0%] 20 min Hopstand
0.88 oz US Goldings [4.0%] 20 min Hopstand

Starter (gulp first time) WLP007 Dry British yeast

The starter scares me the most.  I started it yesterday with 800ml h2o and 80 grams DME and now 24 hrs later have about 1/2 inch of light dark layer sediment on the bottom of my flask with a little foam on the top. Smells like bread. LHBS won't be open until tuesday so hop it works. Should I keep it at room temp until tomorrow when I plan to brew? What about the hops should I go bigger? I figure 12% utilization with the hopstand so my calc IBU is more than enough. I am an ICU RN so I worry endlessly about the little details. Can you say OCD.
Thanks


Offline pete b

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2015, 12:19:20 AM »
I would lose the chocolate malt and get the Raucanteurs back together and tour.
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Offline pete b

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2015, 12:55:07 AM »
Forgot to insert smiley so you know I'm trying to be friendly and not teasing. But seriously I wouldn't use the chocolate malt.
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Offline kmccaf

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2015, 01:18:24 AM »
I would lose the chocolate malt and get the Raucanteurs back together and tour.

Boo! Use more Goldings near the end of the boil and get back together with Meg!
Kyle M.

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2015, 01:19:01 AM »
British-style ale is my specialty.  The chocolate malt should stay.  What has to go is 8 ounces of the crystal malt.  That's way too much crystal malt for a British-style bitter.  If one researches real British-style bitters, one discovers that most British bitters get their color from a small percentage of chocolate or black patent malt.

Here's one of my British-style Bitter recipes:

Boil-Over Bitter (a.k.a. Anglo-American Bitter)

Batch Size: 5 gallons
O.G.: 1.052
F.G.: 1.012
ABV: 5.25%

Grist:

8 lbs Thomas Fawcett Pearl
0.75 lbs Briess Torrified Wheat
1.5 ozs Thomas Fawcett Pale Chocolate

Mash: 90 minutes at 68C

Hops:

1.5 ozs U.S. Cluster 6.2% AA (60 minute boil)
0.75 ozs U.S. Cascade 5.6% AA (10 minute boil)
1.5 ozs U.S. Cascade 5.6% AA (20 minute steep after chilling to 160C)

IBUs: 36

BU:GU Ratio: 0.69

Yeast:  Whitbread "B" (a.k.a. Wyeast 1098, WLP007, S-04)

You can substitute British hops for American hops.

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2015, 01:54:26 AM »
There is a nice Can You Brew It that covers Fullers ESB, including an interview with John Keeting.

In the Sept/Oct 2008 Zymurgy John Keeting has an article on "Extra Special Bitter"

The grain bill is 95% Pale Ale, 5% crystal, and a little chocolate malt for color (yeah that does not equal 100%).

Hops were Target in the boil early, Northdown and Challanger late in the boil. Golding and Target in the fermenters, Goldings in the maturation tanks, and Goldings are added as dry hops in the cask. The time we toured through the cask line, the guide said that Chiswick got 4 plugs (2 oz) in the cask, Pride none, and ESB got 6 plugs (3 Oz!).

They use London tap water, and add gypsum to get the Ca up to about 100 ppm.

One comment on crystal malt in British Bitter. You will see recipes with 0% to a butt load looking through the Camra recipe books. I think it depends on the brewer, and what they want the beer to be. Some also would use invert 2 or 3 to add color, IIRC. Too tired to go hunt those books down tonight, or Ron Pattinson's book with more historic recipes that would contain less crystal.
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Offline pete b

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2015, 02:04:06 AM »
Well I stand corrected. I think you and I both should try chocolate malt in ESB! In tiny amounts.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2015, 02:13:53 AM »
Yeah, I wouldn't think much over 2 oz of chocolate.
Jon H.

Offline brewday

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2015, 02:23:18 AM »
An ounce in a 5 gallon batch is standard for me.  Best Bitters too.
Jon Weaver

Offline jackwhite

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2015, 02:46:50 AM »
Wow thanks for the comments. The grain is already milled but the hops I can play with. Do you think there is enough backbone at this point and boost the aroma/flavor? I usually FWH but the hopstand technique is new to me. Maybe boost the hopstand addition and get both flavor and aroma?

Offline brewday

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2015, 03:39:32 AM »
I think it depends.  If your brewing to style I would put more emphasis on the Magnum for bittering, maybe ~ 40 IBUs.  If your brewing for your tastes then go with what you've got - treat it like an APA.  Regardless I'd try to work in some EKG for dry hopping.
Jon Weaver

Offline pete b

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2015, 01:22:57 PM »
British-style ale is my specialty.  The chocolate malt should stay.  What has to go is 8 ounces of the crystal malt.  That's way too much crystal malt for a British-style bitter.  If one researches real British-style bitters, one discovers that most British bitters get their color from a small percentage of chocolate or black patent malt.

Here's one of my British-style Bitter recipes:

Boil-Over Bitter (a.k.a. Anglo-American Bitter)

Batch Size: 5 gallons
O.G.: 1.052
F.G.: 1.012
ABV: 5.25%

Grist:

8 lbs Thomas Fawcett Pearl
0.75 lbs Briess Torrified Wheat
1.5 ozs Thomas Fawcett Pale Chocolate

Mash: 90 minutes at 68C

Hops:

1.5 ozs U.S. Cluster 6.2% AA (60 minute boil)
0.75 ozs U.S. Cascade 5.6% AA (10 minute boil)
1.5 ozs U.S. Cascade 5.6% AA (20 minute steep after chilling to 160C)

IBUs: 36

BU:GU Ratio: 0.69

Yeast:  Whitbread "B" (a.k.a. Wyeast 1098, WLP007, S-04)

You can substitute British hops for American hops.
I'm interested in this recipe as I've used crystal and no chocolate in my bitters and it seems most recipes are similar. I have the TF Pearl and TF chocolate but only flaked wheat. I was wondering if toasted wheat flakes would give a similar flavor as torrified. I have some wy1968 slurry in the fridge so I probably will use that.
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Offline AmandaK

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2015, 10:08:27 PM »
British-style ale is my specialty.  The chocolate malt should stay.  What has to go is 8 ounces of the crystal malt.  That's way too much crystal malt for a British-style bitter.  If one researches real British-style bitters, one discovers that most British bitters get their color from a small percentage of chocolate or black patent malt.

Here's one of my British-style Bitter recipes:

Boil-Over Bitter (a.k.a. Anglo-American Bitter)

Batch Size: 5 gallons
O.G.: 1.052
F.G.: 1.012
ABV: 5.25%

Grist:

8 lbs Thomas Fawcett Pearl
0.75 lbs Briess Torrified Wheat
1.5 ozs Thomas Fawcett Pale Chocolate

Mash: 90 minutes at 68C

Hops:

1.5 ozs U.S. Cluster 6.2% AA (60 minute boil)
0.75 ozs U.S. Cascade 5.6% AA (10 minute boil)
1.5 ozs U.S. Cascade 5.6% AA (20 minute steep after chilling to 160C)

IBUs: 36

BU:GU Ratio: 0.69

Yeast:  Whitbread "B" (a.k.a. Wyeast 1098, WLP007, S-04)

You can substitute British hops for American hops.
I'm interested in this recipe as I've used crystal and no chocolate in my bitters and it seems most recipes are similar. I have the TF Pearl and TF chocolate but only flaked wheat. I was wondering if toasted wheat flakes would give a similar flavor as torrified. I have some wy1968 slurry in the fridge so I probably will use that.
Don't worry too much about the chocolate/crystal thing. There are many ways to skin a cat.

My recipe is basically mostly Maris Otter, 1/2# English Med Crystal, 1/4# English Xtra Dark Crystal, some UK Goldings, and WY 1968. Seems to work quite well as it wins in large comps. Might not be 'historical', but I like to drink it so that works for me!
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Offline brewday

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2015, 10:41:59 PM »
Don't worry too much about the chocolate/crystal thing. There are many ways to skin a cat.

My recipe is basically mostly Maris Otter, 1/2# English Med Crystal, 1/4# English Xtra Dark Crystal, some UK Goldings, and WY 1968. Seems to work quite well as it wins in large comps. Might not be 'historical', but I like to drink it so that works for me!

+1

That's pretty much my recipe too. I add about an ounce of chocolate purely for color - just my preference.
Jon Weaver

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Re: Thoughts on my ESB recipe
« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2015, 01:30:10 AM »
I'm interested in this recipe as I've used crystal and no chocolate in my bitters and it seems most recipes are similar. I have the TF Pearl and TF chocolate but only flaked wheat. I was wondering if toasted wheat flakes would give a similar flavor as torrified. I have some wy1968 slurry in the fridge so I probably will use that.

I have found that nothing really tastes like torrified wheat, but torrified wheat.   However, feel free to use what you have on hand.  Additionally, I do not know what your efficiency/extraction rate is like, but the recipe is based on an extraction rate of roughly 29 points per pound per gallon (roughly 78% efficiency).  I actually scaled the recipe up from a 3.75 gallon recipe, and reduced the extraction rate by 3 points per pound to make it easier for the average home brewer to make.  All you ready need to do is keep the percentages relatively close.

British Pale Malt 90.5% of the grist (90% or 91% will work if it makes measuring malt easier)
Torrified Wheat  8.5% of the grist (8% or 9% will work if it makes measuring malt easier)
Pale Chocolate  1% of the grist

Wyeast 1968 will work, but Whitbread "B" (Wyeast 1098, WLP007, S-04) is a better strain to use with this recipe.