[wpshadowens]

With Black IPA's seemingly being all the rage right now, has anyone tried to do a Black Rye IPA? This is what I am thinking about brewing tomorrow and would appreciate any feedback I can get. My concern is if the Rye Malt is going to muddy it up too much.

10 lbs Maris Otter  66.67 %
3 lbs Rye Malt 20.00 %
8.0 oz Caramel Munich 60L 3.33 %
4.0 oz Carafa Special III 1.67 %
4.0 oz Pale Choclate 1.67 %
0.75 oz Millennium [15.00 %] (60 min) 31.3 IBU
0.75 oz Chinook [13.00 %] (60 min) 27.2 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo (Leaf) [9.30 %] (15 min) 6.4 IBU
0.50 oz Chinook [13.00 %] (10 min) 6.6 IBU
0.50 oz Centennial [9.00 %] (5 min) 2.5 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo (Leaf) [9.30 %] (0 min) 
1.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc 
1 lbs Corn Sugar (Dextrose) 6.67 %
1 Pkgs Wyeast Rogue Pacman Yeast-Ale

Est Original Gravity: 1.074 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.018 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 7.31 %
Bitterness: 74.0 IBU
Est Color: 21.6 SRM

5 Gallon recipe, Batch Sparge, 65% efficiency, Single infusion mash @ 154 degree
90 min. boil

Thanks,
Bill

[blatz]

I like the idea. Sounds very, very interesting.

Personally, I think you need a lot more late hops, but I'm a big hop flavor/aroma guy over bitterness.

[denny]

Actually, a black rye IPA is pretty much what Bear Republic's Hot Rod Rye is.

[dbeechum]

Not very black though is it?

[bluesman]

Looks good with or without the rye. I agree with Blatz in that I would move out a little of the bitterness (40 IBU total for bitterness) and add more flavor/aroma hops (double what you have now).

[wpshadowens]

Thanks everyone. Here rev. 01, how does this look? Would you recommending holding back on the Carafa and adding it towards the end of the mash?

9 lbs 8.0 oz Maris Otter 63.33 %
3 lbs Rye Malt 0.00 %
12.0 oz Carafa Special III 5.00 %
8.0 oz Caramel Munich 60L 3.33 %
4.0 oz Pale Choclate 1.67 %
0.50 oz Millennium [15.00 %] (60 min) 20.9 IBU
0.50 oz Chinook [13.00 %] (60 min) 18.1 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo (Leaf) [9.30 %] (15 min) 6.4 IBU
0.50 oz Chinook [13.00 %] (10 min) 6.6 IBU
0.50 oz Centennial [9.00 %] (5 min) 2.5 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo (Leaf) [9.30 %] (5 min) 2.6 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo (Leaf) [9.30 %] (0 min) 
0.50 oz Centennial [9.00 %] (0 min)
1.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc 
1 lbs Corn Sugar (Dextrose) 6.67 %
1 Pkgs Wyeast Rogue Pacman Yeast-Ale

Est Original Gravity: 1.074 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.018 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 7.29 %
Bitterness: 57.2 IBU
Est Color: 34.1 SRM

5 Gallon recipe, Batch Sparge, 65% efficiency, Single infusion mash @ 154 degree
90 min. boil

Thanks,
Bill

[Mangled Mash]

I'd move the carafa to the end for color only.  But that's just me..

[majorvices]

Not very black though is it?

Its not black at all!

[wpshadowens]

Ok, how does this look? I upped the Carafa to a Lb & subbed the Pale Chocolate (200 SRM) with Briess Chocolate (350 SRM). I also changed the hop schedule a bit. This all pretty much falls within the BA's style guidelines for a India Black Ale:

Original Gravity 1.056-1.075 ● Apparent Extract/Final Gravity 1.012-1.018 ●
Alcohol by Weight (Volume) 5-6% (6 -7.5%) ● Bitterness (IBU) 50-70 ● Color SRM (EBC) 25+ (50+ EBC)

9 lbs 8.0 oz Maris Otter 63.33 %
3 lbs Rye Malt 0.00 %
1 lbs Carafa Special III 6.56 %
8.0 oz Caramel Munich 60L 3.33 %
4.0 oz Choclate (Briess, 350.0 SRM) 1.67 %
0.75 oz Chinook [13.00 %] (60 min) 27.0 IBU
0.75 oz Millennium [15.00 %] (30 min) 23.9 IBU
0.75 oz Amarillo (Leaf) [9.30 %] (15 min) 9.6 IBU
0.50 oz Chinook [13.00 %] (10 min) 6.5 IBU
0.50 oz Centennial [9.00 %] (5 min) 2.5 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo (Leaf) [9.30 %] (5 min) 2.6 IBU
0.50 oz Centennial [9.00 %] (0 min)
0.50 oz Amarillo (Leaf) [9.30 %] (0 min)
1.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1 lbs Corn Sugar (Dextrose) 6.67 %
1 Pkgs Wyeast Rogue Pacman Yeast-Ale

Est Original Gravity: 1.075 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.018 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 7.51 %
Bitterness: 72.0 IBU
Est Color: 41.4 SRM

5 Gallon recipe, Batch Sparge, 65% efficiency, Single infusion mash @ 154 degree
90 min. boil

Thanks,
Bill

[denny]

Not very black though is it?

Its not black at all!

If you guys say so....it's been a while since I had one.  I brewed a "clone" recipe a few years back and I thought I recalled that one being fairly dark.  I guess it's true what they say...the memory is the second thing to go!  

[wpshadowens]

This may be a dumb question but here goes.

What if I steeped the Carafa in my sparge water as I bring it up to temperature?

[blatz]

This may be a dumb question but here goes.

What if I steeped the Carafa in my sparge water as I bring it up to temperature?

I think you'd be better off steeping the carafa in the first runnings sitting in the kettle while you are sparging.

[bluesman]

Not very black though is it?

Its not black at all!

umm, guys 34 srm is going to be plenty black, IMO.

I'd recommend adding the carafa at the end as well.

I concur.

[richardt]

Pardon the dumb question, but why are so many of you recommending Carafa be added at the end or having the first runnings pass through it?  Why not add it to the mash tun along with all the other grains?

[dbeechum]

I thought I recalled that one being fairly dark.

Yeah it's dark, but really more like dark brick red.

And richard, the reason is to minimize the roast contributions of the grain since part of the fascination with the whole "black IPA" thing is the color of a stout/porter but minimal roast.