Author Topic: Flame Out vs Steeping  (Read 1215 times)

Offline davidgzach

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Flame Out vs Steeping
« on: March 23, 2015, 08:12:37 PM »
I was making a Heady Topper clone this weekend from a recipe I found online.  The recipe called for a flame out (0 boil minute) addition and then a steeping addition.  I couldn't figure out why.  Were the flame out hops supposed to be taken out and then the steeping hops added?  I just added them all at flame out and steeped both additions.

What am I missing?

Dave
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Offline Stevie

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2015, 08:18:29 PM »
I am betting that the person that wrote the recipe was intending for a brewer to add the 0 min hops, chill to steep temp (~170-180), and add the steep hops, in the end leaving all of the hop material in the kettle during the steep.

Offline davidgzach

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2015, 08:21:23 PM »
So since I added them all at flame-out I got more flavor than the intended aroma?
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Offline Stevie

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2015, 08:24:33 PM »
I'm sure it is negligible.

Offline davidgzach

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2015, 08:26:00 PM »
I'm sure it is negligible.

You would think.....
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2015, 09:28:38 PM »
The hops added at flameout would extract a little more bitterness, being added at boiling temp. Not a lot more bitterness though. Whereas the hops added after cooling to 175 or under extract basically no noticeable bitterness, but give you really nice flavor and aromas. Sounds like this will be a good beer regardless.
Jon H.

Offline davidgzach

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2015, 09:48:07 PM »
The hops added at flameout would extract a little more bitterness, being added at boiling temp. Not a lot more bitterness though. Whereas the hops added after cooling to 175 or under extract basically no noticeable bitterness, but give you really nice flavor and aromas. Sounds like this will be a good beer regardless.

Right up your alley Jon:  Simcoe, Apollo, Columbus, Amarillo and Centennial.....
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2015, 09:54:26 PM »
The hops added at flameout would extract a little more bitterness, being added at boiling temp. Not a lot more bitterness though. Whereas the hops added after cooling to 175 or under extract basically no noticeable bitterness, but give you really nice flavor and aromas. Sounds like this will be a good beer regardless.

Right up your alley Jon:  Simcoe, Apollo, Columbus, Amarillo and Centennial.....

Sounds good to me!  That Apollo is a strong one.
Jon H.

Offline mbalbritton

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2015, 03:17:08 AM »
Huh, I did a clone of Highland Gaelic Ale and it it had a steeping hop step at flame out too. I hadn't run across this yet. I just tossed them in the pot at flame out as well. Then let it sit for 15 min before chilling. Didn't occur to me to cool it to 175 first. Oh well.


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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2015, 11:47:12 AM »
Huh, I did a clone of Highland Gaelic Ale and it it had a steeping hop step at flame out too. I hadn't run across this yet. I just tossed them in the pot at flame out as well. Then let it sit for 15 min before chilling. Didn't occur to me to cool it to 175 first. Oh well.



You don't have to cool to 175F, some don't.  I just like to because:   1/  I can control the bitterness in the kettle
2/  less of the volatile oils are driven off @ 175F and under, leaving better hop flavor and aroma IMO.
Jon H.

Offline davidgzach

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2015, 12:03:19 PM »
Huh, I did a clone of Highland Gaelic Ale and it it had a steeping hop step at flame out too. I hadn't run across this yet. I just tossed them in the pot at flame out as well. Then let it sit for 15 min before chilling. Didn't occur to me to cool it to 175 first. Oh well.


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I'm not going to worry about it.  I agree the results are probably undetectable.  RDWHAHB is my thinking.
Dave Zach

Offline ynotbrusum

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2015, 06:51:54 PM »
Not to steal the thread, but has anyone tried adding hops to the boil kettle after fully immersion chilling to run-off/pitch type temperatures?  I.e., doing a chilled hop stand? 

Just wondering if you get some dry hopped quality or will all the potential aromas get scrubbed out during subsequent primary fermentation?
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2015, 07:09:15 PM »
Not to steal the thread, but has anyone tried adding hops to the boil kettle after fully immersion chilling to run-off/pitch type temperatures?  I.e., doing a chilled hop stand? 

Just wondering if you get some dry hopped quality or will all the potential aromas get scrubbed out during subsequent primary fermentation?

Never have. I think a lot of the dry hop character might get scrubbed by fermentation.  As for steeped 'whirlpool' character, the temps might be too cool to extract good flavor. But maybe not. A few years back the conventional wisdom was that whirlpool hopping would cause increased DMS levels - not so.  Who knows? Might be worth trying.
Jon H.

Offline ynotbrusum

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2015, 01:52:54 AM »
Had to try it.  On a Saaz based BoPils, so maybe the restrained fermentation will retain some of it.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Flame Out vs Steeping
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2015, 11:34:42 AM »
Had to try it.  On a Saaz based BoPils, so maybe the restrained fermentation will retain some of it.

Yeah it might.  I look forward to seeing how it comes out for you.
Jon H.