Author Topic: Saison attempt  (Read 6895 times)

Offline klickitat jim

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Saison attempt
« on: April 12, 2015, 06:47:31 PM »
I'm going to take a stab at a saison next. Do any of you saison experts use sugar to help push attenuation?

Here's my very simple recipe
12 lbs pils
2 oz midnight wheat (option, im brewing one with and one without)
Mash 90 min at 145

90 min boil
1/2 oz Magnum at 60
2 oz Mittelfruh in whirlpool starting at 180 for 20 min

Wy3724 starter, pitched at 80º freeride to 90º

I'm considering doing the darker one as is, then a second batch with no color addition and subbing a pound of cane sugar for a pound and a half of pils

Thoughs?

Offline mchrispen

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2015, 07:04:35 PM »
I would skip the cane sugar and do flaked wheat and/or a little raw wheat. A tiny bit of sugar maybe - but I don't necessary like the thinning it can bring to the body. YMMV

I know saisons can be made without wheat, but it seems to add that little something that rounds it out and helps produce a nice fluffy head. It also adds a little nutty character to the malt base and I think complements the grainy pils background. I like the haze it provides as well, especially in a lighter saison. Flaked rye is nice as well.

my 2 cents anyway...
Matt Chrispen
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Blogging from the garage @ accidentalis.com
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Offline Phil_M

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2015, 07:17:35 PM »
I used a pound of amber candy sugar in my recent saison, both for color and to dry it out. Finished at 1.003 with 3724, it's tasty from the fermentor. Hope to bottle it next weekend.

Next time around I may just try 100% pilsner malt just to see where that takes me.
Corn is a fine adjunct in beer.

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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2015, 07:53:22 PM »
I used a pound of amber candy sugar in my recent saison, both for color and to dry it out. Finished at 1.003 with 3724, it's tasty from the fermentor. Hope to bottle it next weekend.

Next time around I may just try 100% pilsner malt just to see where that takes me.

Sounds good !  It's a good feeling to get 3724 to finish low in a timely fashion.
Jon H.

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2015, 10:07:16 PM »
Trouble is that I dont have any wheat, and I dont need another trip. I think I fully agree though, wheat would probably be a help with flavor mouthfeel and appearance. But I'm also on a clear beer kick now that I figured out how to use gelatin. So I think I'll go wheatless this try, and adjust from there. Ive never brewed with this yeast either, so it might help me figure out what flavors are fermentation and whats not, if I keep it simple.

Offline JT

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2015, 10:19:14 PM »
Nothing wrong with a little haze in saison, clear beer is good, but not necesary for every style.  Personally I throw some sugar in my saisons to dry 'em out a bit. 

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2015, 10:35:12 PM »
Nothing wrong with a little haze in saison, clear beer is good, but not necesary for every style.  Personally I throw some sugar in my saisons to dry 'em out a bit. 

Yeah I like a touch of haze in saison - not hefe level, just a touch. Seems like there's more of the saison yeast character that way.
Jon H.

Offline brewday

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2015, 10:46:13 PM »
You could always toss in some oats to get the slight haze/silky mouthfeel.
Jon Weaver

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2015, 10:49:04 PM »
Oats I have. I might do that. Matt mentioned raw wheat. I can probably score some next door at the farmer's. How much do you think?

Offline breweite

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2015, 10:58:18 PM »
I make a lot of saisons and I think simplicity is the best, and let the yeast do its thing.  I've noticed some funky things thrown off by the yeast when I start warm, and I always do starters about 1/2 L bigger than suggested.  It might be something I'm doing wrong, but I've noticed when I start low and finish off warmer I get a lot better yeast character, yes a little cleaner, but for me much more drinkable.

Also, I make my own candi sugar to have more control over flavor/color that way.  However, I don't ever use more than 8% .  I feel that you can get a dry beer with your yeast or 3711 no matter what.

I don't think oats would give you the mouthfeel you're looking for in a saison, just my .02.

Good Luck.
Cheers from Austin, Tejas!

Offline riceral

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2015, 11:32:16 PM »
Next Sunday I'm brewing a saison:
      7.5 # Pilsner
      1.5 # Vienna
      1.0 # wheat
       2 oz Carafa III
      6 AAU Magnum  45 minutes
      6 AAU Hallertau Blanc 5 minutes

Using Saisonstein's Monster yeast

Edit: Just saw your post about no wheat.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2015, 11:34:48 PM by riceral »
Ralph R.

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2015, 11:34:42 PM »
Next Sunday I'm brewing a saison:
      7.5 # Pilsner
      1.5 # Vienna
      1.0 # wheat
       2 oz Carafa III
      6 AAU Magnum  45 minutes
      6 AAU Hallertau Blanc 5 minutes

Using Saisonstein's Monster yeast



Just curious, have you used that yeast before ?  I understand it's a blend of 3724 and 3711.
Jon H.

Offline riceral

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2015, 11:36:27 PM »
Next Sunday I'm brewing a saison:
      7.5 # Pilsner
      1.5 # Vienna
      1.0 # wheat
       2 oz Carafa III
      6 AAU Magnum  45 minutes
      6 AAU Hallertau Blanc 5 minutes

Using Saisonstein's Monster yeast



Just curious, have you used that yeast before ?  I understand it's a blend of 3724 and 3711.

No, I haven't. Came recommended by my LHBS. They haven't steered me wrong yet.

Looking forward to the results.
Ralph R.

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2015, 11:40:23 PM »
Next Sunday I'm brewing a saison:
      7.5 # Pilsner
      1.5 # Vienna
      1.0 # wheat
       2 oz Carafa III
      6 AAU Magnum  45 minutes
      6 AAU Hallertau Blanc 5 minutes

Using Saisonstein's Monster yeast



Just curious, have you used that yeast before ?  I understand it's a blend of 3724 and 3711.

No, I haven't. Came recommended by my LHBS. They haven't steered me wrong yet.

Looking forward to the results.


Cool. I just asked because (before knowing you need to ferment 3724 warmer) I used to pitch 3724, wait for it to stall, then pitch some 3711 to finish up the job quicker. Let us know what you think !
Jon H.

Offline Stevie

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Re: Saison attempt
« Reply #14 on: April 12, 2015, 11:44:14 PM »
The company is advertising it as a hybrid, not a blend.