[gcupples]

I understand that but with descriptions such  as bitter/harsh we immediately thought of mash pH due to roasted grains.  Water chemistry can change seasonally as well.  If you believe over-attenuation is a problem have you tried using different yeasts?

I mostly used harsh/bitter by way of saying the beer was too dry and the roasted-ness stuck out too much. Instead of having some sweetness to balance that out.

What I'm saying is everything I'm making with this mash regimen is attenuating well above what I'm expecting. French Saison, Belgian Ardennes, Witbier, Whitbread, etc...

[bboy9000]

I understand that but with descriptions such  as bitter/harsh we immediately thought of mash pH due to roasted grains.  Water chemistry can change seasonally as well.  If you believe over-attenuation is a problem have you tried using different yeasts?

I mostly used harsh/bitter by way of saying the beer was too dry and the roasted-ness stuck out too much. Instead of having some sweetness to balance that out.

What I'm saying is everything I'm making with this mash regimen is attenuating well above what I'm expecting. French Saison, Belgian Ardennes, Witbier, Whitbread, etc...

Okay.  You probably have the right idea with a shorter mash time.  Although those yeasts you mentioned are all beasts.  Ok, I haven't tried the witbier or whitbread yeast but I always 85-90%+ attenuation with the saison and Belgian Ardennes.  Maybe try wlp 002, Wy 1099 or Danstar Windsor.  Windsor is really known for being a low attenuator.