Author Topic: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?  (Read 2174 times)

Offline johnnyb

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 242
  • Pembroke, NH
    • View Profile
50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« on: August 04, 2015, 08:29:36 PM »
Went to LHBS to get malt for a hefeweizen I'm going to brew soon. They had a problem with their recent supply order and had no pils malt in stock. I remembered (incorrectly as it turns out) that Kai had a hefe recipe with 50:50 wheat to Vienna malt. (Turns out its more like 75:25).

Anyway, I decided to get 5.5 pounds Vianna and 5.5 pounds wheat in the same bag unmilled.

Got home and realized Kai's recipe was more like 25% Vienna. I could add more wheat and get the ratio to about 60:40 wheat to Vienna without getting the gravity too high. Anyone think that grain bill will make a decent hefe?

If not, would it possibly make a good dunkelweizen if I add a little caraffa II for color during the sparge?

Or should I bite the bullet and start over with wheat and pils like I originally planned? As it turns out, after he bagged the wheat and Vienna he told me he didn't have the yeast I wanted, so I have to take a drive anyway.


Offline dmtaylor

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3263
  • Two Rivers, WI
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2015, 09:29:11 PM »
Sounds like an excellent grist for a dunkelweizen.  Add a little Carafa if you've got it and make the dunkelweizen!

Weizenbiers are pretty much all about the yeast anyway.  The malt is important, to a certain point, but does not totally make the style like the yeast does.  Use the right yeast and the malt bill doesn't matter nearly so much.

Anyways, honestly, do you really need to care about style at all??  Are you entering this into competition??  If not, then who cares!!!!  It will taste awesome no matter what you do, truly it will.

Cheers.
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline pete b

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3123
  • Barre, Ma
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2015, 01:29:09 PM »
.

Anyways, honestly, do you really need to care about style at all??  Are you entering this into competition??  If not, then who cares!!!!  It will taste awesome no matter what you do, truly it will.

Cheers.
That's the spirit! I think it will taste good too.
Don't let the bastards cheer you up.

Offline johnnyb

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 242
  • Pembroke, NH
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2015, 02:28:07 PM »
Sounds like an excellent grist for a dunkelweizen.  Add a little Carafa if you've got it and make the dunkelweizen!

Weizenbiers are pretty much all about the yeast anyway.  The malt is important, to a certain point, but does not totally make the style like the yeast does.  Use the right yeast and the malt bill doesn't matter nearly so much.

Anyways, honestly, do you really need to care about style at all??  Are you entering this into competition??  If not, then who cares!!!!  It will taste awesome no matter what you do, truly it will.

Cheers.


I only care about the style as far as I want to make a very tasty hefeweizen. But no, I don't enter competitions and never had any desire to do so.




Offline beersk

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3484
  • In the night!
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2015, 02:39:07 PM »
Sounds like an excellent grist for a dunkelweizen.  Add a little Carafa if you've got it and make the dunkelweizen!

Weizenbiers are pretty much all about the yeast anyway.  The malt is important, to a certain point, but does not totally make the style like the yeast does.  Use the right yeast and the malt bill doesn't matter nearly so much.


I don't think it has to be ALL ABOUT THE YEAST. I have a hefe on tap right now that is 55% wheat, the other half of the grist is equal amounts of vienna and munich. It's awesome. It's still pretty light in color but has a really nice malt character to pair with the banana/clove of the 3068 yeast. It's one of the best hefes I've brewed.

And I think dunkelweizen typically should have Munich I or II in it, not Vienna. You want that malty sweetness from the Munich in dunkelweizen.

So, JohnnyB, I say go for it. You won't be disappointed with the results.
die Schönheit der bier...

Jesse

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 4439
  • Play Nice
    • View Profile
    • Harvey's Brewhaus
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2015, 04:57:57 PM »
+1 to everything stated already. i like 60-65% wheat and think you will be happy with your plan. just decide hefe or dunkel and go for it accordingly!
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline johnnyb

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 242
  • Pembroke, NH
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #6 on: August 06, 2015, 11:08:46 PM »
Ok thanks all.

I was thinking about saving the mixed Vienna/wheat grain for a dunkel and getting new grain for a standard hefe. But apparently some force wants me using this Vienna in the standard hefeweizen as I drove over 100 miles today and still couldn't get my hands on any German pils.

So I got 2 more pounds of wheat, and I'm going to do a hefeweizen with what now works out to 60:40 wheat to Vienna.



 

Offline ynotbrusum

  • I spend way too much time on the AHA forum
  • ********
  • Posts: 2805
  • Da mihi sis cerevisiam.
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2015, 11:58:08 AM »
I think you will love it - Schneider-ized Hefeweizen!
Hodge Garage Brewing: "Brew with a glad heart!"

Offline beersk

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3484
  • In the night!
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2015, 01:24:35 PM »
Yeah, man, vienna and/or munich as the other half of the base malt for a hefe is amazing. It still turns out pretty light, I don't know what all this talk about dunkelweizen is about. I have one on tap that is still about 5 SRM with about 60% wheat and 20ish percent each of vienna and munich, with a little acid malt for pH adjustment. It's awesome.
die Schönheit der bier...

Jesse

Offline Slowbrew

  • Brewmaster General
  • *******
  • Posts: 2382
  • The Slowly Losing IT Brewery in Urbandale, IA
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2015, 09:46:04 PM »
It should taste great but with that much wheat don't rush the sparge.  It will work but it will be a bit gummy.  To me it falls in the "patience grasshopper" category.   ;D

Paul
Where the heck are we going?  And what's with this hand basket?

Offline johnnyb

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 242
  • Pembroke, NH
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2015, 12:02:04 AM »
Yeah, man, vienna and/or munich as the other half of the base malt for a hefe is amazing. It still turns out pretty light, I don't know what all this talk about dunkelweizen is about. I have one on tap that is still about 5 SRM with about 60% wheat and 20ish percent each of vienna and munich, with a little acid malt for pH adjustment. It's awesome.

I was going to use some Caraffa II if I decided to make it into a dunkel. I just thought the extra maltiness of that much Vienna might be better suited to a dunkel, which is how the idea got tossed around.

Going to brew it Sunday as a normal hefeweizen.

Plan to add about a half pound of rice hulls to help it drain well.

Offline bboy9000

  • Brewmaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 703
  • KCMO
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2015, 12:50:25 AM »
I bet it will make a nice Hefeweizen.  My jefe last summer was just wheat and pils and although it was good, I highly it could've had  some more malt character.  I bet the Vienna would've done the trick.
Brian
mobrewer

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 4439
  • Play Nice
    • View Profile
    • Harvey's Brewhaus
50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2015, 01:41:22 PM »
One hint with all that wheat- double crush or adjust mill tighter for the wheat. Smaller kernels and no husk and if you don't get a good crush you will likely see gravity of preboil wort few points lower than expected.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline johnnyb

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 242
  • Pembroke, NH
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2015, 01:54:09 PM »
One hint with all that wheat- double crush or adjust mill tighter for the wheat. Smaller kernels and no husk and if you don't get a good crush you will likely see gravity of preboil wort few points lower than expected.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks.

I actually adjust my recipe calculations for wheat because my mash extraction will drop from about 76% to about 72%.



 

Offline beersk

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3484
  • In the night!
    • View Profile
Re: 50:50 or 60:40 Wheat to Vienna for Hefeweizen?
« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2015, 06:26:35 PM »
Yeah, man, vienna and/or munich as the other half of the base malt for a hefe is amazing. It still turns out pretty light, I don't know what all this talk about dunkelweizen is about. I have one on tap that is still about 5 SRM with about 60% wheat and 20ish percent each of vienna and munich, with a little acid malt for pH adjustment. It's awesome.

I was going to use some Caraffa II if I decided to make it into a dunkel. I just thought the extra maltiness of that much Vienna might be better suited to a dunkel, which is how the idea got tossed around.

Going to brew it Sunday as a normal hefeweizen.

Plan to add about a half pound of rice hulls to help it drain well.
Ah, I missed that. Sounds great, I think you'll really like what the vienna adds to the malt profile.
die Schönheit der bier...

Jesse