Author Topic: New barrels  (Read 2813 times)

Offline yso191

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1682
  • Yakima, WA
    • View Profile
New barrels
« on: August 25, 2015, 04:28:04 PM »
I picked up my new 8 gallon Rye Whiskey barrel today.  The RIS going into it should be ready in a week or so.  The real reason I'm posting is that they also had small, 2 liter charred oak barrels for sale for $60.  No whiskey has been in them.  I bought one thinking it would be ideal for experiments, specifically sour beer experiments.  I'm not big into sours but have enjoyed a few.  At 2 liters it may be just the right size!



Oh, and here is the big one.
Steve
All Hands Brewing
BJCP #D1667

Offline morticaixavier

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 7782
  • Underhill VT
    • View Profile
    • The Best Artist in the WORLD!!!!!
Re: New barrels
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2015, 05:56:20 PM »
If it's never been used for ageing liquor it's going to be overwhelmingly oaky. you could buy a couple handles of some type of white whisky and age your own though
"Creativity is the residue of wasted time"
-A Einstein

"errors are [...] the portals of discovery"
- J Joyce

Offline yso191

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1682
  • Yakima, WA
    • View Profile
Re: New barrels
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2015, 06:11:25 PM »
If it's never been used for ageing liquor it's going to be overwhelmingly oaky. you could buy a couple handles of some type of white whisky and age your own though

Good to know.  They told me they age their whiskey in the 8 gallon barrels for 2 years - what time do you think it would take to get it useable for beer?
Steve
All Hands Brewing
BJCP #D1667

Offline klickitat jim

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 7506
    • View Profile
Re: New barrels
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2015, 07:40:27 PM »
Or, prep it with a sour? Meaning that the first one may not be very good but at least it did its job.

However, it seems to me that a barrel that's smaller than a bbl is not going to be the same as what the pros do.

Fill it with a finished beer~ 3-4 plato and pitch a smack of roselare blend in it. Leave it alone for about 6 months.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 07:42:29 PM by klickitat jim »

Offline majorvices

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 9290
  • Polka. If its too loud you're too young.
    • View Profile
    • Yellowhammer Brewing Company
Re: New barrels
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2015, 03:34:42 AM »
I would recommend adding hot water, let sit over night and drain a couple times. It's going to be really oaky otherwise.

Offline morticaixavier

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 7782
  • Underhill VT
    • View Profile
    • The Best Artist in the WORLD!!!!!
Re: New barrels
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2015, 05:04:57 AM »
If it's never been used for ageing liquor it's going to be overwhelmingly oaky. you could buy a couple handles of some type of white whisky and age your own though

Good to know.  They told me they age their whiskey in the 8 gallon barrels for 2 years - what time do you think it would take to get it useable for beer?

everything happens faster with a smaller barrel. as the surface area shrinks the volume shrinks much faster so more surface per unit of volume = more oak contact and more air contact
"Creativity is the residue of wasted time"
-A Einstein

"errors are [...] the portals of discovery"
- J Joyce

Offline sambates

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 83
    • View Profile
Re: New barrels
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2015, 06:22:33 AM »
Since it's so small, you could find some cheap wine and put that in the barrel first and then do a sour in there. Maybe a wine that hasn't been oaked yet? Or buy white dog, as suggested, to turn it into another whiskey barrel. Smaller barrels will age quicker (http://www.woodinvillewhiskeyco.com/products/age-your-own-whiskey-kit/) and Woodinville tells you that. I say do something fun and different that you know you'll enjoy!
Tap: Brandy Barrel Sour, Brett IPA, Tart Cherry Berliner, Sour Coffee Porter, Witbier, Helles Bock, Helles Bock Braggot, Strawberry "Nebraskambic," Raspberry Flanders
Secondary: OatRye Blonde, Plout Sour, Blueberry Ginger Sour
Primary:Belgian Dark Strong, Scottish Wee Heavy, American Session Wild Ale, Brandy Barrel "Lincolnambic"

Offline MattDel1700

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 9
    • View Profile
    • To Brew a Beer
Re: New barrels
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2015, 07:31:35 AM »
Quote
everything happens faster with a smaller barrel. as the surface area shrinks the volume shrinks much faster so more surface per unit of volume = more oak contact and more air contact

This, and you have some options.

Take a look at at the link below, which has ratios for varying size barrels compare to a full size. One option is to paraffin wax the outside of the barrel (after doing a formula to determine how much to cover) to limit the oxygen exchange, so you can age it in the barrel for longer to simulate a larger barrel.

You can also use the chart to determine how many days are "equal" to one year in the barrel, and then use that number as a rule of thumb.

Keep in mind that beer ages differently than whisky, so two years for whisky might be great but might not be the same for beer.

http://redheadoakbarrels.com/barrel-info/barrel-dimensions/

Offline hopfenundmalz

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 8463
  • Milford, MI
    • View Profile
Re: New barrels
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2015, 08:14:33 AM »
If he puts a sour beer in there, then the barrel will be inoculated with bugs and critters, and only good for sours afterward.
Jeff Rankert
Ann Arbor Brewers Guild
AHA Governing Committee
BJCP National
Home-brewing, not just a hobby, it is a lifestyle!

Offline erockrph

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 6069
  • Chepachet, RI
    • View Profile
    • The Hop WHisperer
Re: New barrels
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2015, 08:19:32 AM »
Take a look at at the link below, which has ratios for varying size barrels compare to a full size. One option is to paraffin wax the outside of the barrel (after doing a formula to determine how much to cover) to limit the oxygen exchange, so you can age it in the barrel for longer to simulate a larger barrel.

You can also use the chart to determine how many days are "equal" to one year in the barrel, and then use that number as a rule of thumb.

Keep in mind that beer ages differently than whisky, so two years for whisky might be great but might not be the same for beer.

http://redheadoakbarrels.com/barrel-info/barrel-dimensions/
Bookmarked! Thanks for the link - some great info in there!
Eric B.

Finally got around to starting a homebrewing blog: The Hop Whisperer

Offline reverseapachemaster

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3063
    • View Profile
    • Brain Sparging on Brewing
Re: New barrels
« Reply #10 on: August 27, 2015, 08:09:10 AM »
http://redheadoakbarrels.com/barrel-info/barrel-dimensions/

It looks like the surface area calculations are incorrect. For a standard 53 gallon whiskey barrel the diameter of the head is approximately 22" and the barrel stave length is approximately 35".

If the surface area of a cylinder is A=2*pi*rh+2*pi*r2 then the calculation should be:

A = 2*3.14*11*35+2*3.14*11^2 = 3179.29

Given that their number is roughly twice that I suspect diameter was used in the calculation rather than radius.

Feel free to tell me I am wrong here.
Heck yeah I blog about homebrewing: Brain Sparging on Brewing

Offline yso191

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1682
  • Yakima, WA
    • View Profile
Re: New barrels
« Reply #11 on: August 27, 2015, 09:41:57 AM »
For we math-numbskulls, what does this mean if you are correct?  Does the oak-aging occur faster or slower than what the website says?
Steve
All Hands Brewing
BJCP #D1667

Offline BairsBrewing

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 101
    • View Profile
Re: New barrels
« Reply #12 on: August 27, 2015, 01:14:46 PM »
How much was the big one? Did you go up to Woodinville to buy them?

Offline yso191

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1682
  • Yakima, WA
    • View Profile
Re: New barrels
« Reply #13 on: August 27, 2015, 02:18:18 PM »
How much was the big one? Did you go up to Woodinville to buy them?

$145.  The link is above most of the time.  Yes, I picked it up in person but the will ship them.
Steve
All Hands Brewing
BJCP #D1667

Offline reverseapachemaster

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3063
    • View Profile
    • Brain Sparging on Brewing
Re: New barrels
« Reply #14 on: August 27, 2015, 03:33:25 PM »
For we math-numbskulls, what does this mean if you are correct?  Does the oak-aging occur faster or slower than what the website says?

I'm mathematically challenged myself, I just noticed the number for a 53 gallon barrel were substantially different from what I had seen elsewhere.

I'm not sure where they went wrong in their calculations. The contact time periods may be accurate in relation to each other or the numbers may be so off that the data is uselessly inaccurate. If we knew the barrel radius and stave length for each barrel size we could recalculate all the numbers but I don't have that information.
Heck yeah I blog about homebrewing: Brain Sparging on Brewing