[Joe Sr.]

Can't help myself...

[Stevie]

Would love to but can't.  Blichmann kettle with electric element and Hopblocker.  I chill using two stage CFC. 

I could try not whirlpooling and run immediately into the kettle.  Been scared to, given some of the warnings
about clogging.  Have had this system for 3 years now and have just resorted to this as my process but am open to suggestions.

Running through the counter flow chiller back to the kettle shouldn't be an issue with all the hop and break material. A plate chiller could be a completely different story. Keep on keeping on if what you do works for you.

[ynotbrusum]

I see Denny's point now about the dextrins being in there because of a failed conversion, but that is kinda the point here - maybe it will counteract the dilution from the shorter boil... Or not!  All I know is that it was a lower OG than expected and it is fermenting vigorously at 51F.  If it is watery, I can blend it with some light ale or another Pilsner.

[klickitat jim]

My second suspect would be difference in wort chilling speed. If they weren't identical, but merely similar, I suppose my 3rd suspect might be different maltsters/cultivars.

I whirlpool at 180-190 for a half hour before chilling, and I think a lot of pro breweries do the same or longer, how does that coincide with what youre saying?

I'd have to look it up, but "they" say that SMM is converted to DMS at or above a certain temp. I think that temp is in the neighborhood of 180º, but not certain. So... what I am saying is that at <212º at sea level, you aren't getting much rolling action to help blow off the DMS. So it seems important, if there still is a significant enough amount of SMM present, to get that wort below the conversion temp rapidly.

Now, if you are whirlpooling with a pump, like I do, like I suspect many pros do, it seems to me that is somewhat replicating the action of a rolling boil. Perhaps that helps reduce DMS to some degree.

When my boil is done I immediately start my whirlpooling immersion chiler. With my system, I have a temperature half-life of 1 minute. In other words I go from 212º down to half way to well water temp in 1 minute. In other words, I go from 212 to 130 in a minute. I have to be jonny on the spot to hit 170º. Usually that means shutting off the water at 185. If it drops to 165, I hit the flame again to get 170. Then I add my hops and whirlpool for 30 min. At 170 I'm not worried about SMM or DMS.

If it takes 30 minutes to drop from 212º to 170º I'm saying, potentially, thats a DMS problem

[blatz]

Gotcha - I understand now.

I knock down to 185 pretty quick before whirlpooling, though I am reconsidering my partially covering my kettle after the knockdown going forward.

Thanks for the clarification.

[klickitat jim]

No problem. Remember though, its just my understanding. Not settled fact.

[erockrph]

I have not tried it with Pils malt, but I have done covered, 90-minute whirlpools starting at flameout and ending in the mid-160's using pale US 2-row. I have never picked up any DMS in those beers. I know it's just one data point, but my thought is that once the DMS precursors are gone, then you're all set from that point.

[hopfenundmalz]

I have not tried it with Pils malt, but I have done covered, 90-minute whirlpools starting at flameout and ending in the mid-160's using pale US 2-row. I have never picked up any DMS in those beers. I know it's just one data point, but my thought is that once the DMS precursors are gone, then you're all set from that point.

I usually leave the lid off when it is above 140-150F ish. No problems for 2 row. I chill the lagers after the fire is out like a good German brewer, following procedure.