Author Topic: New Guy - In deep  (Read 1112 times)

Offline JJeffers09

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New Guy - In deep
« on: October 02, 2015, 03:07:32 PM »
Okay, so I started this venture like everyone I assume.  I love beer, there are so many different variations, and I seem to really love the difficult beers.  The complex, medium-full bodied, medium love of bitters (not an IPA junky - there is so much more to great beer than how bitter can we go),  and I can not get enough of English dark malty beers, and Belgium spicy and funky yeasts, or German hazy chewy foamy delightful biers.  With this all being said, my wife finally had enough of listening to me ramble on on and on, and gave me the go ahead to just start brewing.

With all of this in mind, I set out for a fruity, medium bodied, bready, sweet, fist full of wheat, high haze, etc. German/Bavarian inspired Raspberry wheat ale.  So assuming I would make a beer inspired by an Ayinger Bier - Brau-Weisse.  So bready, banana, clove, nutmeg, medium-light hop, and ADD an big Raspberry sweet/tartness that blends well with the style.  Also because that is a beer both my wife and I really enjoy.  I tried to dip in a little darker than the Hefeweizen and lean closer to the Dunkelweizen.  To my surprise the .25 lbs of Special B Malt (3% of my grain bill) gave me that black tea color and that roastey-red color at first during mash out and boil.  When I poured it over to the primary it was this great orange-red-yellow blend that really looked like a light Dunkelweizen and very suprised at the stone fruit smell of my experimental hops {El Dorado} At any rate.  Super confused 5 days into primary I thief out some beer to check on my progress.  It looks exactly like Berliner-style Weisse!  So super confused, poured black tea to get a very hazy blonde almost cream ale color.  My big question is what happened?

I did taste a shot of it after I took the gravity.  Added 1/4tsp of Raspberry Extract to get an idea of what it was going to give me.  Understanding that this is Un-carbonated far from final product of the beer, but I wanted an idea.  Much to my surprise as well I had a very pleasant creamy banana texture and smell on the beer, a bit more hops that I was looking for, and a smooth finish.  After adding the Raspberry I got absolutely none of that flavor which concerned me...

Also my OG - was 1.059 and 5 days into it, its still fermenting strong but Gravity is standing at 1.020 so obviously it has much more to go. Super excited about racking it over to condition, but it looks like (assuming) I have a day or two to go.  Now when I say strong fermenting, there are bubbles every 3-5 seconds and the lid is really bubbled over.  I have it on a blow-off tube to a sani-bucket, and the lid is still puffed up.  And like I said on day 5 (5 full days in 4 hours from now)

Another BIG topic on my mind is I am adding Raspberry Extract to my Bottling/Carbonation stage.  Which leads me to wonder how much I will really need.  I keep seeing online forums talk about Vanilla extract and how quickly it gets lost in the bottle.  I really would like the Raspberry notes to be present but not overpowering.  Also I would love to know what my beer tastes like in a year or two.  And would love to know if the raspberry will just disappear by then.  My initial thought was putting in 4-5 oz, yup oz, of Raspberry extract to my 5.25 gallons. But I read that if it were Vanilla that would be WAY TO MUCH. Advise?
« Last Edit: October 02, 2015, 04:21:29 PM by JJeffers09 »
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Offline Slowbrew

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2015, 04:28:12 PM »
Generally you will hear the following advice:

1) Be patient, the beer will get done when it gets done.

2) You can speed it up a bit after the gravity gets down by warming it up a bit.  Raising the temp won't hurt at the end of the ferment.

3) There really aren't a lot of reasons to rack off to a secondary.  There are many good reason to leave it in the primary longer.  The main one being that it will give the yeast time to clean up after themselves.

4) When you do get to packaging, pull some samples and do controlled additions of the extract in small amounts of beer.  A couple os ounces of beer at a time and add extract with a dropper.  Each drop has a standard addition measurement (I don't recall it right now but others will).  Guessing can get you in trouble when adding fruit flavorings as they cannot be removed.

Over all it sounds like you are doing very well with the batch.

Paul
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Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2015, 04:35:37 PM »
Everything Paul says is good.

As far as the color, right now you likely have a lot of yeast in suspension so it will look lighter than it will when the yeast drops out.  You're also tasting the yeast in your sample, so the flavors will change by the time you package it.

I don't know much about raspberry extract, but if it is fermentable it will add to your carbonation level in the bottles and you should account for that at packaging.

If this is your first batch, it sounds like you have a good handle on what you're doing.
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Offline JJeffers09

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2015, 04:56:43 PM »
This is my first batch.  I let the Yeast settle to the bottom of the shot class, and cooled it, for about 1 hour.  I was surprised to see that there was quite a bit of white yeast layer on the bottom of the shot glass.  But I was still disappointed not to get that reddish copper color I started with.  It really did orange out from the "Black Tea" Color it started with.  The WLP351 yeast is awesome, and really healthy it looks like anyway.  However, just as an open question I am better to rack off to a secondary for the beer to settle out, and yeast to fall out of suspension right?  I was just super surprized to see that the color went from I mean Oktoberfest - Honey Lager color to a Blonde Wheat color!  I figured 3% Special B Malt would really lift up the SRMs to closer to the 10-15 ranges not the 5-10 I am in now.  I also have Honey (11.9%) and Bel. Caramel 20L (8.7%) in there to get that toasty caramel sweet flavor profile to go along with my bread/dough melanoidin flavor of Special B
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Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2015, 05:02:04 PM »
There is really no need to rack to a secondary.  Most of us on this forum do not, unless there is some specific reason to do so, such as adding fruit, or a secondary yeast, or something like that.

I leave my beers in the same fermenter for 4 weeks or so and then rack into kegs for serving.
It's all in the reflexes. - Jack Burton

Offline JJeffers09

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2015, 09:16:44 PM »
There is really no need to rack to a secondary.  Most of us on this forum do not, unless there is some specific reason to do so, such as adding fruit, or a secondary yeast, or something like that.

I leave my beers in the same fermenter for 4 weeks or so and then rack into kegs for serving.

Okay so Racking (Bottling Bucket) it to add priming sugar and Fruit Extract for more than immediate bottling is the idea of NOT conditioning the beer in a secondary?  I do agree that every book I have picked up Dating prior to 2010 states exactly that I need to condition the beer in a secondary to clarify the beer. (and Beer Smith Program) to drop yeast out of suspension and get beer off of the trub, as well as lending a hand to getting more hop/grain sediment out of the beer.  And It seems that there is not a reason to get beer into a secondary? But I don't want to bottle what is floating around my primary or the gunk all over the sides of my primary.  So what rack the beer over to a bottling bucket and go straight to the bottle?  There is a big difference between knowledge and experience...  the two together makes wisdom.  So gimme the Wisdom friends, what best practices should be used to add fruit flavor with the carbonation?
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Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2015, 09:24:24 PM »
If you take care in racking to the bottling bucket, you should not carry over any significant sediment.  Start your siphon high in the beer and lower it as the volume drops.

The older theory that leaving the beer on the trub and yeast will lead to autolysis and off flavors has not proven out in my experience and that of many others.  Of bigger concern to many of us is the possibility of oxidizing or otherwise introducing contaminants into the beer with an extra (and unnecessary) transfer.

Your beer should clear just fine in the primary fermenter.  You can add gelatin to further clarify it if you like, or cold crash it if you have the opportunity/equipment.

With all that said, you can certainly transfer to a secondary vessel if that's what you want to do.  Just take care in the transfer to avoid splashing and make sure you clean and sanitize everything thoroughly.
It's all in the reflexes. - Jack Burton

Offline santoch

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2015, 06:27:28 PM »
Welcome to the hobby-

According to your OP, it is only 5 days into this fermentation.  Give it time.  We realize that you are anxious, but you are frotzing way too much with this at this stage.  Leave it alone so that the yeast have time to finish up.  They will drop and clear up the beer a lot.  The yeast work on their schedule, not yours.

Get a second fermenting bucket and make another batch to take your mind off of this one.  That way you can let this one finish out.  Give it at least 2 weeks.  Your patience will be rewarded.
HTH-

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Offline TexasHumuluslupulushead

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2015, 08:33:40 PM »
Another BIG topic on my mind is I am adding Raspberry Extract to my Bottling/Carbonation stage.  Which leads me to wonder how much I will really need.  I keep seeing online forums talk about Vanilla extract and how quickly it gets lost in the bottle.  I really would like the Raspberry notes to be present but not overpowering.  Also I would love to know what my beer tastes like in a year or two.  And would love to know if the raspberry will just disappear by then.  My initial thought was putting in 4-5 oz, yup oz, of Raspberry extract to my 5.25 gallons. But I read that if it were Vanilla that would be WAY TO MUCH. Advise?[/b]
[/quote]

Kits from Austin Home Brew and Northern Brewer typically come with 2oz of flavor extract with directions mentioning something to the tune of, for pronounced flavor add all 2oz for subtle add less...

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Offline JJeffers09

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2015, 01:00:38 PM »
Welcome to the hobby-

According to your OP, it is only 5 days into this fermentation.  Give it time.  We realize that you are anxious, but you are frotzing way too much with this at this stage.  Leave it alone so that the yeast have time to finish up.  They will drop and clear up the beer a lot.  The yeast work on their schedule, not yours.

Get a second fermenting bucket and make another batch to take your mind off of this one.  That way you can let this one finish out.  Give it at least 2 weeks.  Your patience will be rewarded.
HTH-

Steve

That is a damn good idea.  Now I need to make up a reason to tell the wife Why I have to make another batch. lol
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Offline JJeffers09

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Re: New Guy - In deep
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2015, 03:20:29 PM »
Thank you everyone for your input and help settle me down for my first batch!

As an update for anyone reading, Final Gravity is out and it is chilling for another week.  I obtained 87% attenuation [ 1.058 to 1.007 ] so looking at 6.7% ABV on this Dunkelweizen.  My beginner recipe Id be happy to post with my notes and such.  However with this beer, I get strong banana, spicy dark fruit hops, raspberry color, sweet/tart raspberry aroma (Very flat on the flavor),and a medium 20 second body/mouthfeel.  It almost has a fresh banana bread character that is just PERFECT for what I was shooting for, and THATS what I get from a flat beer.  Bottling starts this upcoming Sunday, and I can not wait to crack one chilled and pour over to a Vase and sip on the patio! 3 weeks in counting!
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