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Author Topic: New to all grain a few ?'s  (Read 4025 times)

Online denny

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2015, 02:05:36 pm »
All of the following relates to batch sparging....

skip the mashout...it's not needed

to determine the amount of sparge water...after you run off the mash, measure how much you have in the kettle.  subtract that from your total boil volume.  The answer you get is how much sparge water to use.  Yes, it's that easy!
If I do it as described would you recommend sparging the rest with 170 degree water?

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If you do it as I described, I'd use 185-190F water.  It's the grain bed temp, not the water temp, that matters.  FWIW, I mash with about 1.65 qt./lb. these days and get better results than when I used less. 
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Offline wvmtneer

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #16 on: October 05, 2015, 02:26:05 pm »
All of the following relates to batch sparging....

skip the mashout...it's not needed

to determine the amount of sparge water...after you run off the mash, measure how much you have in the kettle.  subtract that from your total boil volume.  The answer you get is how much sparge water to use.  Yes, it's that easy!
If I do it as described would you recommend sparging the rest with 170 degree water?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

If you do it as I described, I'd use 185-190F water.  It's the grain bed temp, not the water temp, that matters.  FWIW, I mash with about 1.65 qt./lb. these days and get better results than when I used less.
Ok, thanks for the info!

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Offline wvmtneer

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #17 on: October 05, 2015, 03:42:42 pm »
All of the following relates to batch sparging....

skip the mashout...it's not needed

to determine the amount of sparge water...after you run off the mash, measure how much you have in the kettle.  subtract that from your total boil volume.  The answer you get is how much sparge water to use.  Yes, it's that easy!
If I do it as described would you recommend sparging the rest with 170 degree water?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

If you do it as I described, I'd use 185-190F water.  It's the grain bed temp, not the water temp, that matters.  FWIW, I mash with about 1.65 qt./lb. these days and get better results than when I used less.
Is this suitable for 5 gallon batch?

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Online denny

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #18 on: October 06, 2015, 10:21:24 am »
ANY size....I use it for 5.5, 8 and 10 gal. batches.  That's as big as I brew, but there's a 7 bbl. brewery near me who batch sparges and gets efficiency in the 90s.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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evil_morty

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #19 on: October 06, 2015, 10:52:54 am »
ANY size....I use it for 5.5, 8 and 10 gal. batches.  That's as big as I brew, but there's a 7 bbl. brewery near me who batch sparges and gets efficiency in the 90s.

as another data point I'm typically 80-85% efficiency into the fermentor and as mentioned I do a small batch sparge (1.5-3 gallons of sparge to hit a 12 gallon pre-boil volume).

Offline wvmtneer

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #20 on: October 06, 2015, 02:42:44 pm »
ANY size....I use it for 5.5, 8 and 10 gal. batches.  That's as big as I brew, but there's a 7 bbl. brewery near me who batch sparges and gets efficiency in the 90s.
How do you calculate efficiency?

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Online denny

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #21 on: October 06, 2015, 03:05:37 pm »
ANY size....I use it for 5.5, 8 and 10 gal. batches.  That's as big as I brew, but there's a 7 bbl. brewery near me who batch sparges and gets efficiency in the 90s.
How do you calculate efficiency?

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Yiou start with the theoretical potential extract from the grain....around 36 points per lb. gal. is average.  so 10 lb. of grain in 5 gal. would give you a theoretical max of (10*36)/5 or a 1.072 OG.  If you got a 1.065 OG, your efficiency would be 65/72 or about 90%.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline Slade7077

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #22 on: October 06, 2015, 07:10:40 pm »
I've read that exposing the hot grain to air is bad & hence you need to keep the liquid above the grain, but I'm not sure if this is true or yet another brewing myth.

If that's the wrong way to do it, I've made 487 batches of bad beer and won some awards for it!

Denny, you are the reason I am all grain brewing.  Everybody else made it seem so complicated.  After listening to you on the Beersmith podcast I researched your methods, built a mashtun, and have at least 79% efficiency per batch.  Thank you so much.  I am brewing the best beer possible, having the most fun possible, and doing the least amount of work!

Offline ynotbrusum

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #23 on: October 06, 2015, 07:38:24 pm »
What would it be called if you run off the first amount of wort and then sprinkle the second "batch" sparge onto the grain bed before running it off?  Is it the sprinkling that is significant or is it a continuous collection and water addition that makes it cross the line to being a "sparge"?
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evil_morty

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #24 on: October 06, 2015, 08:16:21 pm »
What would it be called if you run off the first amount of wort and then sprinkle the second "batch" sparge onto the grain bed before running it off?  Is it the sprinkling that is significant or is it a continuous collection and water addition that makes it cross the line to being a "sparge"?

not sure but I think you'd be better off at that point stirring it up.  I'd expect a dryish grain bed to channel like a mofo.

Offline a10t2

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #25 on: October 06, 2015, 08:56:01 pm »
not sure but I think you'd be better off at that point stirring it up.  I'd expect a dryish grain bed to channel like a mofo.

You might be better off, but from a practical standpoint it could be better to run dry. I worked on a small brewpub system that had the outlet of the mash tun only about a foot off the floor. Consequently, we had to pump from the tun to the kettle. Switching from no-sparge to what we called "Denny-sparging" took the efficiency in that brewhouse from ~70% to ~83%.
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evil_morty

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #26 on: October 07, 2015, 03:57:04 am »
ANY size....I use it for 5.5, 8 and 10 gal. batches.  That's as big as I brew, but there's a 7 bbl. brewery near me who batch sparges and gets efficiency in the 90s.
How do you calculate efficiency?

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Yiou start with the theoretical potential extract from the grain....around 36 points per lb. gal. is average.  so 10 lb. of grain in 5 gal. would give you a theoretical max of (10*36)/5 or a 1.072 OG.  If you got a 1.065 OG, your efficiency would be 65/72 or about 90%.

don't forget to factor in actual final volume into that.

evil_morty

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #27 on: October 07, 2015, 03:58:56 am »
not sure but I think you'd be better off at that point stirring it up.  I'd expect a dryish grain bed to channel like a mofo.

You might be better off, but from a practical standpoint it could be better to run dry. I worked on a small brewpub system that had the outlet of the mash tun only about a foot off the floor. Consequently, we had to pump from the tun to the kettle. Switching from no-sparge to what we called "Denny-sparging" took the efficiency in that brewhouse from ~70% to ~83%.

maybe it's too early in the morning but I'm not following you.  or maybe you weren't following me.  or maybe both  :P

I was telling him not to try to "fly sparge" on a dry grain bed.  you seem to be comparing no sparge with batch sparging.  in general yes, batch would be better than no sparge when it comes to efficiency.

Offline BrewBama

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #28 on: October 07, 2015, 04:24:45 am »
ANY size....I use it for 5.5, 8 and 10 gal. batches.  That's as big as I brew, but there's a 7 bbl. brewery near me who batch sparges and gets efficiency in the 90s.
How do you calculate efficiency?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Yiou start with the theoretical potential extract from the grain....around 36 points per lb. gal. is average.  so 10 lb. of grain in 5 gal. would give you a theoretical max of (10*36)/5 or a 1.072 OG.  If you got a 1.065 OG, your efficiency would be 65/72 or about 90%.
Do those 36 points apply regardless of grain type? IOW you've taken into account some grains will only contribute color, complexity, and flavor?

I've heard others say to expect 5 points per lb of grain. I guess that's the 70% I see all the recipes written for.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2015, 04:32:17 am by BrewBama »

evil_morty

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Re: New to all grain a few ?'s
« Reply #29 on: October 07, 2015, 04:28:50 am »
ANY size....I use it for 5.5, 8 and 10 gal. batches.  That's as big as I brew, but there's a 7 bbl. brewery near me who batch sparges and gets efficiency in the 90s.
How do you calculate efficiency?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Yiou start with the theoretical potential extract from the grain....around 36 points per lb. gal. is average.  so 10 lb. of grain in 5 gal. would give you a theoretical max of (10*36)/5 or a 1.072 OG.  If you got a 1.065 OG, your efficiency would be 65/72 or about 90%.
Do those 36 points apply regardless of grain type? IOW you've taken into account some grains will only contribute color, complexity, and flavor?

that's his assumption but if you want to really nail it down you can usually find estimates for the potential of different grains.  36 is just the average.

for instance in my spreadsheet I have 2-row at 36, munich at 37, carared at 35, victory at 34, etc.