Author Topic: Shaking  (Read 1926 times)

RPIScotty

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Shaking
« on: October 27, 2015, 05:15:31 PM »
I was looking at a 1 gallon jug the other day (I ferment in them) and something grabbed my interest. I can really shake the bejesus out of them to oxygenate.

Some of the discussions that have evolved out of the "Shaken, Not Stirred" discussions involved the O2 demands of the majority of the brewer's yeast available to homebrewers. Mark has stated a few times that most of these strains are Class O1 or O2 strains with respect to O2 demand (4-8 ppm).

I'm no super brain but it would seem to me that those of you using ~5 gal buckets and carboys would have a hell of a time shaking that vessel and getting the kind of foam I get shaking my 1 gallon jug. 5 gallons of water weighs about 40 lbs. and a carboy an additional 10 lbs. or so.

I guess my question is this: For those that shake or swirl the carboy/bucket, is it even possible for you, given the weight of the liquid and the vessel combined, to shake/swirl vigorously enough to reach saturation? Obviously a MixStir or Pure O2 will get you there no problem, and in the absence of a DO meter, this post is a moot point, but I couldn't help but entertain the thought.

Offline beersk

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2015, 05:25:51 PM »
Probably not, especially given that the head space of the vessel is a key component to the method. 5 gallons in a 6.5 carboy would not have the necessary head space to get the proper foaming.
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Offline Phil_M

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2015, 05:30:21 PM »
I usually ferment 5-5.5 gallons in a 6.5 gal carboy. While I have no idea how much oxygen ends up dissolved in the wort, I'm usually able to get the headspace very nearly full of foam.

I set the carboy on a rubber mat in my garage, then tip it over to about it's balance point and shake back and forth vigorously. Usually I'll do it for at minimum two minutes, sometime longer depending on how much my forearms are burning.
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RPIScotty

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2015, 05:35:31 PM »
I have no idea how much DO I get either, but I take that 1 gallon jug and shake the hell out of it. It's super light and I throw the cap on and have at it.

Offline morticaixavier

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2015, 05:39:56 PM »
I'm fond of a good old balloon whisk. I can fill the headspace on a 7.9 gallon bucket from a 5 gallon batch of wort with foam and only a moderately sore elbow.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2015, 05:43:58 PM »
Mix stir for my buckets.
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RPIScotty

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2015, 05:47:04 PM »
Mix stir for my buckets.

I noted that the MixStir/O2 crowd didn't have any worries.

Offline beersk

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2015, 06:01:29 PM »
The only thing that makes me nervous about using a mix stir in a bucket is I use the same drill to mill my grains. See what I'm sayin'?
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RPIScotty

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2015, 06:02:24 PM »
The only thing that makes me nervous about using a mix stir in a bucket is I use the same drill to mill my grains. See what I'm sayin'?

You need another drill.

Offline Stevie

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2015, 06:05:35 PM »
I use the same drill and never thought about it. I do wipe the chuck down with a sanitizer soaked paper towel and use better bottles.

Offline JJeffers09

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2015, 07:00:00 PM »
Isn't an aquarium pump the answer to this problem though?  $9 dollar pump will oxygenate 10-100 gallons of water.
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Offline Stevie

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2015, 07:18:50 PM »
I used to use an aquarium pump but gave it up after dealing with clogged diffusion stones. Mix stir is basically unbreakable.

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2015, 07:21:15 PM »
I guess my question is this: For those that shake or swirl the carboy/bucket, is it even possible for you, given the weight of the liquid and the vessel combined, to shake/swirl vigorously enough to reach saturation?

It's definitely possible to get close (since you can only asymptotically approach saturation). It's just a question of how long it takes. A bucket of wort sitting at ale pitching temperature will eventually reach 9 ppm DO. Shaking just accelerates the process. I get that the real question is whether you can endure enough shaking to get near that. This paper would suggest yes.

I run filtered air at 2.5 psi through a stone for 10 min and call it good.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2015, 08:05:10 PM by a10t2 »
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Offline kramerog

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2015, 07:26:49 PM »
Wyeast says that 40 seconds of splashing and shaking is enough. https://www.wyeastlab.com/hb_oxygenation.cfm.  To me splashing and shaking is a lot less work than shake until  turned into foam.

I just noticed that White Labs does not agree in its FAQ.

Offline 69franx

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Re: Shaking
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2015, 08:32:10 PM »
Before I had my aeration stone I would pour back and forth from my BK to fermenter several times till frothy and had great results from my fermentations.  Not really an answer, just another (semi?)viable option?
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