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Author Topic: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference  (Read 9124 times)

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2015, 03:58:51 pm »
I suppose to be fair I ought to fine them both, then dry hop one. Otherwise folks will claim cheating due to one being over hazy. It should only be dry hop haze present.

I still suspect that average drinkers will chose the brilliant one.

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #16 on: December 29, 2015, 04:11:07 pm »
I suppose to be fair I ought to fine them both, then dry hop one. Otherwise folks will claim cheating due to one being over hazy. It should only be dry hop haze present.

I still suspect that average drinkers will chose the brilliant one.


Yeah, some people will choose on clarity alone. And IPA is its own animal - no way to dry hop that much and not be hazy (which is fine by me). But I fined an APA last year (IIRC the one I sent Sean in the first swap) before dry hopping that ended up being pretty clear anyway. It was lager clear before I dry hopped and was still pretty clear by the time I shipped.
Jon H.

Offline fmader

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #17 on: December 31, 2015, 08:23:30 pm »
I've been wanting to post on this thread in regards to Jim's experiment with low temp whirlpool, but I've been sick and couldn't pour a beer to snap a picture of until now. I'm excited to learn about the results on a flavor basis. But I'm a bit reluctant on substituting dry hops just for the purpose of clarity. This beer pictured below is an IPA that had 8 oz in the kettle. The only fining was a whitlflic tab added at 10 minutes. The wort is filtered through a knee high stocking into the bucket. After fermentation, 5 oz of dry hops were added to the keg in a suspended knee high stocking. They stayed in for two weeks before being pulled. Within a couple days, it was clearing up. In two weeks, it looks like this....



Like I said, I'm anxious to hear about the flavor/aroma impact, but I think the emphasis on clarity on a dry hopped beer isn't even an issue.
Frank

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #18 on: December 31, 2015, 08:33:08 pm »
Looks nice, Frank. What I'm doing isn't far off what you've done here. I'm doing a big whirlpool addition, crashing, using gelatin, kegging, then dry hopping in keg ( I leave 'em in, too). The beer ends up clearer than some but doesn't lose any dry hop character, and that character sticks around for a bit. Liking it.


Edit - I agree with keeping the dry hops where they're right for the beer.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2015, 08:48:43 pm by HoosierBrew »
Jon H.

Offline denny

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #19 on: January 01, 2016, 08:56:37 am »
At Jim's suggestion, the next experiment on the Experimental Brewing podcast will test immediate whirlpool hops vs. 120F whirlpool hops.  Get involved!

http://www.experimentalbrew.com/experiments/hop-whirlpool-does-steeping-lower-temperature-improve-final-hop-character
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline fmader

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #20 on: January 01, 2016, 09:03:12 am »
At Jim's suggestion, the next experiment on the Experimental Brewing podcast will test immediate whirlpool hops vs. 120F whirlpool hops.  Get involved!

http://www.experimentalbrew.com/experiments/hop-whirlpool-does-steeping-lower-temperature-improve-final-hop-character

Excellent!
Frank

Offline Pricelessbrewing

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #21 on: January 02, 2016, 05:25:59 pm »
At Jim's suggestion, the next experiment on the Experimental Brewing podcast will test immediate whirlpool hops vs. 120F whirlpool hops.  Get involved!

http://www.experimentalbrew.com/experiments/hop-whirlpool-does-steeping-lower-temperature-improve-final-hop-character

Much better!    ;D

Offline yso191

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2016, 05:42:32 pm »
At Jim's suggestion, the next experiment on the Experimental Brewing podcast will test immediate whirlpool hops vs. 120F whirlpool hops.  Get involved!

http://www.experimentalbrew.com/experiments/hop-whirlpool-does-steeping-lower-temperature-improve-final-hop-character

Has anything happened with this?  I get a message saying "Access Denied."

Also, KlickitatJim, do keep us posted on your APA experiment.
Steve
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2016, 05:52:19 pm »
I think the experiment sounds cool. I think aroma will be nice at 120F, with flavor diminished and obviously no bitterness extracted at all, as compared to flameout steeping. I'd be curious  to see how 120F compares to 170-175F, which I prefer. I'm considering adding an oz or two of hops @ 120F as I cool my next APA or AIPA (without steeping), to check out the quality and quantity of aroma there.
Jon H.

Offline Pricelessbrewing

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2016, 06:11:34 pm »
I don't know a whole lot about the subject, but it's very interesting. In my mind I relate the timings like this.

60-45 mostly bitterness
30-15 mostly bitterness, some flavor additions.
30-15 minor ibu, medium flavor, little aroma.
15-0 medium flavor, good aroma.
180-160 whirlpool/steep strong flavor, different flavor profile than >180 due to different oil content remaining in solution, strong aroma.
<160 similar to a smaller dry hop. Some aroma will be lost during primary as c02 scrubs it. Would probably subtitute as a dry hop instead.

Offline denny

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #25 on: January 04, 2016, 10:13:26 am »
At Jim's suggestion, the next experiment on the Experimental Brewing podcast will test immediate whirlpool hops vs. 120F whirlpool hops.  Get involved!

http://www.experimentalbrew.com/experiments/hop-whirlpool-does-steeping-lower-temperature-improve-final-hop-character

Has anything happened with this?  I get a message saying "Access Denied."

Also, KlickitatJim, do keep us posted on your APA experiment.

That's weird....I'll ask Drew to look into it.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline denny

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2016, 10:22:31 am »
At Jim's suggestion, the next experiment on the Experimental Brewing podcast will test immediate whirlpool hops vs. 120F whirlpool hops.  Get involved!

http://www.experimentalbrew.com/experiments/hop-whirlpool-does-steeping-lower-temperature-improve-final-hop-character

Has anything happened with this?  I get a message saying "Access Denied."

Also, KlickitatJim, do keep us posted on your APA experiment.

That's weird....I'll ask Drew to look into it.

Should be available now....
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline denny

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2016, 10:37:57 am »
Here's a note from Drew if you want to sign up to be an IGOR and get involved in the experiment....

Don't forget - if you want to get involved right now - please signup here

http://www.experimentalbrew.com/signup

The next experiment is now live to the public and we have 6 weeks to turn it around (Hop Whirlpool Temps). For this first of two hop experiments, buy your hops and I'll get you new hops from NikoBrew to replace them. For the FWH experiment, please sign up in the next two weeks and I'll get you hops ahead of time!
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #28 on: January 04, 2016, 10:55:06 am »
I'll be doing the 170/120 test but a little late. My brew docket is booked for about 6 weeks. I am really looking forward to a test between a 120 for 15 wirlpool vs dry hopping for 4 days after FG, using the same hops and amounts for each.

Offline erockrph

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Re: Whirlpool/ 0 Minute Addition Difference
« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2016, 02:53:12 pm »
I'm overdue for an IPA and it looks like I might have a brew day open next Monday. I think I'll try my usual hop schedule (11 oz flameout whirlpool, 5 oz dry hops) but shorten my flameout whirlpool and add my dry hops at 120F instead. It won't be an apples to apples comparison since I won't have time to do a side by side, but it's a recipe that I know well enough to get a feel for what this change is doing.

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