[klickitat jim]

I'm overdue for an IPA and it looks like I might have a brew day open next Monday. I think I'll try my usual hop schedule (11 oz flameout whirlpool, 5 oz dry hops) but shorten my flameout whirlpool and add my dry hops at 120F instead. It won't be an apples to apples comparison since I won't have time to do a side by side, but it's a recipe that I know well enough to get a feel for what this change is doing.

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Awesome,  I'll stay tuned. What I will be looking for when I do it is a clear pretty beer that has "sufficient" hop aroma. Not trying to replicate dry hopping aroma, just come close and still have great clarity. The ultimate test would be 3 brews, all the same along the way until whirlpool. One would get a dose at 120 for 15, the other two would get that 120/15 charge in dry hop for 4 days after FG is reached. The 120/15 beer would get crashed and gel fined. One of the dry hopped beers would get crashed and gel fined at FG but before dry hopping, and the third beer would get no fining at all. This would show the 3 differences. 1. Does 120/15 provide sufficient aroma to make the clarity worth it? 2. How does it stack up aroma wise to gell fined dry hopped? 3. How does gell fining then dry hop stack up to non gell fined dry hop?

Finally, a retest of all three beer 3 months later and 6 months later...

[ynotbrusum]

Wow, that would be a great comparison - but do you give college credits for this full semester class?  Lol. 

[klickitat jim]

Wow, that would be a great comparison - but do you give college credits for this full semester class?  Lol.

Yes. Actually I'll give them in advance,  just tell your college admin to add them to your thing. However many you feel is appropriate.

[erockrph]

Wow, that would be a great comparison - but do you give college credits for this full semester class?  Lol.

Yes. Actually I'll give them in advance,  just tell your college admin to add them to your thing. However many you feel is appropriate.

"Independant Study under Prof. Jim at Klickitat U" will definitely make my LinkedIn profile at some point

[ultravista]

I recently purchased a March pump but haven't used it in the brewing process yet. Regarding the whirlpool, can I simply draw from the kettle, and recirculate? I don't have the right equipment yet to really get a whirlpool moving (in the right direction), but can recirculate.

Shame on me for assuming but ... won't recirculating achieve the same results?

I am not attempting to cone wort debris in the center ...

[coolman26]

I recently purchased a March pump but haven't used it in the brewing process yet. Regarding the whirlpool, can I simply draw from the kettle, and recirculate? I don't have the right equipment yet to really get a whirlpool moving (in the right direction), but can recirculate.

Shame on me for assuming but ... won't recirculating achieve the same results?

I am not attempting to cone wort debris in the center ...

Draw from the bottom and clamp your hose at an angle and it will whirlpool. I'd make sure you have a dip tube. Drawing without dip tube, screen, or something could be clogging. I know from my first time trying this same thing.

[weiht]

I agree with the dif temperatures extracting the optimal hop oils, but I won't fret it if I'm not able to chill my wort down to 69c to do a whirlpool (If u use plate chillers).

Considering that breweries deal with MUCH larger qty than ours, I doubt that they whirlpool anywhere lower than 90-95c. With some hops, i get quite a noticeable amounts of flavour coming through even at 60mins addition. I see it like enzymes in the mash, your beta-amalyse are still working at 67c and it's doesn't denature instantly. Yes, you lose a certain amount of aroma if you whirlpool hot, but the quality of the hops make a bigger difference than the temperature of the whirlpool. Not to mention that most of us here add a crazy amount of whirlpool hops, so I think that you will gain more aroma with that huge quantity than what you will lose whirlpool at 95-100c. Then again, where is the point of diminishing returns with regards to whirlpool/flame out addition? Where is the point where it's out of our threshold to taste?

I used to chill my wort down to 80c before addition my whirlpool hops, as I wanted to stop isomerising AA. I would add my 60mins/15-0mins to achieve my intended IBU, and then add my aroma hops at 80c and do a whirlpool. I used 345gms in the kettle for a 6 gallon batch of DIPA and another 190 gms of dry hop.

Of late, I've been starting to switch to 30 mins whirlpool at flame out for better hop utilisation and it does save me alot of hops!! The late hops aroma is very delicate and amazing, and can be overpowered if you aggressively dry hop. That's one of the reasons why i'm adopting this approach, along with a chance I'll strike lottery and go pro, then I'll have to adopt this method!

Coming back, you will get better extraction with a whirlpool than just flame out addition, purely due to agitation. Just like steeping a tea bag in hot water, with and without agitation.

Some breweries have a whirlpool built into their kettle, but the BIG ones usually have a separate whirlpool vessel.

To be honest, I've not done enough brews with this new process, but the initial response to far is a cleaner hop aroma/flavour without being muddy. I'm also trying to master this because I wanna add about 1.5-2lbs/bbl of whirlpool hops for certain beers, but that may give too much BU and end up with a 130ibu beer!

[ultravista]

Draw from the bottom and clamp your hose at an angle and it will whirlpool. I'd make sure you have a dip tube. Drawing without dip tube, screen, or something could be clogging. I know from my first time trying this same thing.

I hop in a 300 micron strainer so the wort is free and clear (with the exception of proteins).

I may give this a shot. Kill the flame, let it cool a bit, add a dose of hops, start recirculating, wait, then add the second/third dose of flame out hops.

A recent Heady Topper clone was interesting. No hops in the boil - two hop shots at 60 minutes, then a flame out addition with a 20 minute pause, then a second flame out at 180F with a second 20 minute pause, then chill.

By far, this has been my best tasting double IPA. So much so that I plan on doing the same for a Pliny the Elder clone. A single heavy charge at the beginning of the boil, then flameout, 180F (or cooler), and dry hop.

The funny thing is that I have had the March pump for several years and haven't used it yet.

[weiht]

Do be careful when adding hops as you running the pumping. I had some pellets choking the pump before, and you don't wanna take it apart when it's hot and having to sanitise it again..etc.

Since then, I've stopped the pump running for a minute to allow the pellets to hydrate before turning on the pump again.

Have fun!

[klickitat jim]

Do be careful when adding hops as you running the pumping. I had some pellets choking the pump before, and you don't wanna take it apart when it's hot and having to sanitise it again..etc.

Since then, I've stopped the pump running for a minute to allow the pellets to hydrate before turning on the pump again.

Have fun!

Yup. If I dump more than an ounce in I have to do that or it will throw the magnetic bond. "Zip-clink" Then you have to kill the pump and restart. I thought it was my pump going gunnybag till I figured it out. Ive contemplated some sort of filter but have found that killing the pump and dumping hops down the middle of my IC, wait a minute, then turn pump back on... works fine.

[ultravista]

I use a 300 micron hop filter, it's 18x6 inches. Nothing gets out of there ...

Good advice, thank you.