Author Topic: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!  (Read 1277 times)

Offline brulosopher

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Bitterness in beer is important, as is the way that bitterness is perceived. Certain types of hops are said to impart a more harsh bitterness, while others apparently produce a smoother bitterness, which many believe to be a function of different levels of cohumulone. Interested in the impact hops with different levels of this compound have, we performed an xBmt to test it out. Results are in!


http://brulosophy.com/2016/03/07/bittering-hops-high-vs-low-cohumulone-exbeeriment-results/

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2016, 01:32:03 PM »
Have you read this?
http://www.barthhaasgroup.com/johbarth/images/pdfs/2009_BWI_Cohumulon.pdf

There was also a talk at NHC a couple years back where the IBUs were equal, I didn't attend that one. You might have to listen to the audio fill.

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/presentations/pdf/2014/Cohumulone%20Friend%20or%20Foe.pdf
« Last Edit: March 07, 2016, 01:39:21 PM by hopfenundmalz »
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Offline brulosopher

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2016, 02:07:37 PM »
Have you read this?
http://www.barthhaasgroup.com/johbarth/images/pdfs/2009_BWI_Cohumulon.pdf

There was also a talk at NHC a couple years back where the IBUs were equal, I didn't attend that one. You might have to listen to the audio fill.

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/presentations/pdf/2014/Cohumulone%20Friend%20or%20Foe.pdf

Great article! If I didn't link to it in my xBmt article, I meant to, it's one of the many I referred to while writing.

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2016, 02:16:46 PM »
Have you read this?
http://www.barthhaasgroup.com/johbarth/images/pdfs/2009_BWI_Cohumulon.pdf

There was also a talk at NHC a couple years back where the IBUs were equal, I didn't attend that one. You might have to listen to the audio fill.

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/presentations/pdf/2014/Cohumulone%20Friend%20or%20Foe.pdf

Great article! If I didn't link to it in my xBmt article, I meant to, it's one of the many I referred to while writing.

After doing a dive into this subject, I concluded I would worry about it as much as I worry about HSA.
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Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2016, 03:21:15 PM »
Fantastic xBmt.  I think it's good to know that not every single piece of conventional wisdom out there is false -- we actually heard one thing right for a change.  Cohumulone does make a difference.  I'll bet I personally would prefer the smoother low CoH type, but I can just see homebrewers everywhere now who will start bittering everything with Chinook to take their IIIIIIPAs to the next level.  So, congrats(?).   ;D
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Offline denny

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2016, 04:00:01 PM »
I have long preferred Chinook for bittering APA/AIPA.  When people tell me they use Magnum for those, I kinda wonder why.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2016, 04:05:05 PM »
I definitely like Chinook to bitter AIPA. It has a nice IPA bitterness.
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Offline santoch

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2016, 04:09:36 PM »
This doesn't surprise me, either.  I have long preferred to go in the middle by adding a small amount of Chinook (on the order of .25-.5 oz in 5 gallons) along side a larger dose of low cohumulone hops to give a bit of an edge to the bitterness without getting harsh.  To me, that's the best of both worlds.
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Offline erockrph

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2016, 04:18:58 PM »
Thanks for another great xBmt, Marshall! When I do batches of single-hop trials, I definitely notice a difference in the quality of bitterness between the different hops. It would be interesting to go back to some of my tasting notes and see if the CoH levels line up with my experience.

I wonder if this has any bearing on why beers with no bittering addition (i.e., all IBU's from the whirlpool) seem to have a smoother bitterness than those with a traditional 60-minute addition. It could be just hop choice coming into play, but maybe less iso-CoH is produced by that technique. Every time I see one of these experiments it makes me wish I had a GC/MS in my garage to help answer the myriad of other questions it seems to lead to.

Given the narrow margin of significance on this one, I'd say this would be a good candidate for an IGOR followup, to see if a bigger sample size will result in a clearer conclusion.
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Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #9 on: March 07, 2016, 04:25:23 PM »
I have long preferred Chinook for bittering APA/AIPA.  When people tell me they use Magnum for those, I kinda wonder why.

It's a purely subjective, eye of the beholder thing.  So that's never gonna be resolved across an entire hobby or industry, that's for sure.

I was just posting on another forum that I use Hallertau for much of my bittering.  Two reasons: 1) I grow my own so I always have some, and 2) because I think Hallertau tastes awesome when used for bittering.  I pick up a lot of flavor from it, and the LONGER it's boiled, not the shorter.  Right wrong indifferent, that's been my experience.  And, hey, I've got several ounces of homegrowns sitting here and it's been like a constant 4.8-5.0% alpha for the past 6 years (or at least it tastes that way to me), so why not.  I've never been impressed when reserving them as late additions, but they're great for all my bittering.
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Offline beersk

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2016, 05:07:16 PM »
I also am a huge fan of Chinook. One of the first IPAs I ever made was an all Chinook Rye IPA, so that's probably why I like it so much.
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Offline brulosopher

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2016, 07:40:29 PM »
Thanks for another great xBmt, Marshall! When I do batches of single-hop trials, I definitely notice a difference in the quality of bitterness between the different hops. It would be interesting to go back to some of my tasting notes and see if the CoH levels line up with my experience.

I wonder if this has any bearing on why beers with no bittering addition (i.e., all IBU's from the whirlpool) seem to have a smoother bitterness than those with a traditional 60-minute addition. It could be just hop choice coming into play, but maybe less iso-CoH is produced by that technique. Every time I see one of these experiments it makes me wish I had a GC/MS in my garage to help answer the myriad of other questions it seems to lead to.

Given the narrow margin of significance on this one, I'd say this would be a good candidate for an IGOR followup, to see if a bigger sample size will result in a clearer conclusion.

I so hope D&D have their IGORs redo this one! I definitely plan to continue playing with it. I only wish there was a better way to get differing CoH levels without using different hops. Hmm.

Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #12 on: March 07, 2016, 08:01:18 PM »
I so hope D&D have their IGORs redo this one! I definitely plan to continue playing with it. I only wish there was a better way to get differing CoH levels without using different hops. Hmm.

Yeah... guess you've got to seek out that tincture of pure CoH.  Good luck with that!!  I hear you can get THC though.

When you said D&D, my mind drifted for a second...... almost makes sense, too.  ;)
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Offline denny

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2016, 08:05:36 PM »
Thanks for another great xBmt, Marshall! When I do batches of single-hop trials, I definitely notice a difference in the quality of bitterness between the different hops. It would be interesting to go back to some of my tasting notes and see if the CoH levels line up with my experience.

I wonder if this has any bearing on why beers with no bittering addition (i.e., all IBU's from the whirlpool) seem to have a smoother bitterness than those with a traditional 60-minute addition. It could be just hop choice coming into play, but maybe less iso-CoH is produced by that technique. Every time I see one of these experiments it makes me wish I had a GC/MS in my garage to help answer the myriad of other questions it seems to lead to.

Given the narrow margin of significance on this one, I'd say this would be a good candidate for an IGOR followup, to see if a bigger sample size will result in a clearer conclusion.

I so hope D&D have their IGORs redo this one! I definitely plan to continue playing with it. I only wish there was a better way to get differing CoH levels without using different hops. Hmm.

Maybe all 3 of us should put our heads together and see if there's a better way to do this.
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Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Bittering Hops: High vs. Low Cohumulone | exBEERiment Results!
« Reply #14 on: March 07, 2016, 08:18:27 PM »
Maybe all 3 of us should put our heads together and see if there's a better way to do this.

I sense an inevitable establishment of either a merger or a mutual respect society of some sort.

Another part of me wishes James Spencer and/or Chris Colby would also jump on board somewheres.  It would be like a non-holy non-trinity at that point... mega nerdy pragmatic awesomeness... jolly good and which no one could deny.
Dave

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