Author Topic: acidulated malt addition  (Read 2778 times)

Offline TMULLEN96

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 12
    • View Profile
acidulated malt addition
« on: March 09, 2016, 02:17:10 PM »
Okay, so I have been all grain brewing for some years now and am looking to brew a kolsch but a lot of the recipes I see have a small percentage of acidulated malt in them. My question is do I actually need to use this in my recipe for style guidelines? I use pH 5.2 Stabilizer in my mash and my water profile has never given me an issue before. Just wanted some feed back before I head to my lhbs.

Offline HoosierBrew

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 13030
  • Indianapolis,IN
    • View Profile
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2016, 02:22:39 PM »
Just me - I wouldn't use 5.2 or acid malt. 5.2, in spite of what your LHBS might say, does not work and can give your beer a minerally off flavor. I use RO water and Brunwater software to control my pH pretty effectively. And acid malts might or might not be consistent from maltster to maltster (or batch to batch) in their acid content. I use lactic acid to drop pH, which can be accounted for in Brunwater. The software actually helps you predict and control your pH for a given grist. My $0.02  .


Edit -  Here's a link for Brunwater. It's really great software :

https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/
« Last Edit: March 09, 2016, 02:29:59 PM by HoosierBrew »
Jon H.

Offline blatz

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3423
  • Paul Blatz - Jupiter, FL
    • View Profile
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2016, 02:36:53 PM »
yeah 5.2 is garbage.

I used acid malt in my lighter german styles, lactic in lighter American styles.  I don't know why I switch between the two - I'm just quirky like that.
The happiest people don’t necessarily have the best of everything; they just make the best of everything they have.

BJCP National: F0281

Offline HoosierBrew

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 13030
  • Indianapolis,IN
    • View Profile
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2016, 02:39:29 PM »
I know the Germans use acid malt, so I know it works. I've just always been more leery as compared to measuring out the lactic. Personal preference I guess.
Jon H.

Offline blatz

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3423
  • Paul Blatz - Jupiter, FL
    • View Profile
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2016, 02:40:40 PM »
I know the Germans use acid malt, so I know it works. I've just always been more leery as compared to measuring out the lactic. Personal preference I guess.

ive never had a problem being within .03-.05 pH with AM - same as when I use weighed out lactic.
The happiest people don’t necessarily have the best of everything; they just make the best of everything they have.

BJCP National: F0281

Offline HoosierBrew

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 13030
  • Indianapolis,IN
    • View Profile
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2016, 02:41:47 PM »
I know the Germans use acid malt, so I know it works. I've just always been more leery as compared to measuring out the lactic. Personal preference I guess.

ive never had a problem being within .03-.05 pH with AM - same as when I use weighed out lactic.

Good info.
Jon H.

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 19376
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2016, 03:50:28 PM »
+1 on 5.2 being useless. 
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline dilluh98

  • Brewmaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 575
    • View Profile
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2016, 04:12:57 PM »
+1 on 5.2 being useless.

It kind of boggles my mind that LHBSs still carry the stuff.

Offline Stevie

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 6858
    • View Profile
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2016, 04:21:31 PM »
 Does anybody at the AHA have a good relationship with the Five Star folks? Maybe they could get Five Star to chime in on 5.2?

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 4439
  • Play Nice
    • View Profile
    • Harvey's Brewhaus
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2016, 04:30:12 PM »
acid malt works and is just malt treated with lactic- i've used per weyermanns guidlines with RO water:
    
"Weyermann® Acidulated Malt is perfect to adjust the pH level in mash or wort. There is a simple formula to calculate the dosage of Acidulated Malt: You have to use 1% of Acidulated malt to reduce the pH by 0.1. (Example: 3% Acidulated malt reduce the pH leve in mash by 0.3).

The exact effect depends of course on the special conditions in the mash or wort (buffering capacity …) and on the composition of the brew water.

Weyermann Acidulated Malt is produced by using lactic acid, which is generated by on grain natural occurring lactic bacteria. Therefore Acidulated Malt is also a wonderful possibility to produce beer styles with a typical “sourish” character like “Berliner Weisse”.

To reach the “sourish” character 8% of Acidulated malt are a perfect rate. In my recipe there are also recommendations for Fermentis Yeast strains for an authentic aroma and flavour profile"
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 19376
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2016, 04:58:20 PM »
acid malt works and is just malt treated with lactic- i've used per weyermanns guidlines with RO water:
    
"Weyermann® Acidulated Malt is perfect to adjust the pH level in mash or wort. There is a simple formula to calculate the dosage of Acidulated Malt: You have to use 1% of Acidulated malt to reduce the pH by 0.1. (Example: 3% Acidulated malt reduce the pH leve in mash by 0.3).

The exact effect depends of course on the special conditions in the mash or wort (buffering capacity …) and on the composition of the brew water.

Weyermann Acidulated Malt is produced by using lactic acid, which is generated by on grain natural occurring lactic bacteria. Therefore Acidulated Malt is also a wonderful possibility to produce beer styles with a typical “sourish” character like “Berliner Weisse”.

To reach the “sourish” character 8% of Acidulated malt are a perfect rate. In my recipe there are also recommendations for Fermentis Yeast strains for an authentic aroma and flavour profile"

What's hard for me to understand is why you'd use it instead of just using lactic acid.  Same result, right?
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 4439
  • Play Nice
    • View Profile
    • Harvey's Brewhaus
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2016, 04:59:21 PM »
acid malt works and is just malt treated with lactic- i've used per weyermanns guidlines with RO water:
    
"Weyermann® Acidulated Malt is perfect to adjust the pH level in mash or wort. There is a simple formula to calculate the dosage of Acidulated Malt: You have to use 1% of Acidulated malt to reduce the pH by 0.1. (Example: 3% Acidulated malt reduce the pH leve in mash by 0.3).

The exact effect depends of course on the special conditions in the mash or wort (buffering capacity …) and on the composition of the brew water.

Weyermann Acidulated Malt is produced by using lactic acid, which is generated by on grain natural occurring lactic bacteria. Therefore Acidulated Malt is also a wonderful possibility to produce beer styles with a typical “sourish” character like “Berliner Weisse”.

To reach the “sourish” character 8% of Acidulated malt are a perfect rate. In my recipe there are also recommendations for Fermentis Yeast strains for an authentic aroma and flavour profile"

What's hard for me to understand is why you'd use it instead of just using lactic acid.  Same result, right?

just another option I suppose.
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 19376
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2016, 05:21:15 PM »

just another option I suppose.

Sure, that makes sense.  It's just that the pragmatist in me wondered why.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline Wort-H.O.G.

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 4439
  • Play Nice
    • View Profile
    • Harvey's Brewhaus
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2016, 05:28:04 PM »

just another option I suppose.

Sure, that makes sense.  It's just that the pragmatist in me wondered why.

i don't find either very different in difficulty to use. I use weyermann and haven't found any consistency issues in potency in the 10# bag I bought while ago. 

not sure if I will ever buy any of the acid malt again or not. I just did at one point and figure I  mind as well get my money out of it.
Ken- Chagrin Falls, OH
CPT, U.S.Army
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Harveys-Brewhaus/405092862905115

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Science_of_Mashing

Serving:        In Process:
Vienna IPA          O'Fest
Dort
Mead                 
Cider                         
Ger'merican Blonde
Amber Ale
Next:
Ger Pils
O'Fest

RPIScotty

  • Guest
Re: acidulated malt addition
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2016, 06:00:14 PM »
I've just gotten used to working it into my grain bills so I don't want to switch.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk