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Author Topic: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!  (Read 3455 times)

Offline euge

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2016, 11:02:36 am »
I think we're all doing the same thing essentially with some variances.


The website I use has "absorption" factored for the mash. It's not explicit by any means, but the extra water could come in the form of a mashout, which I think Denny was alluding to.

I haven't done a mashout... so long ago.
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Offline witster

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2016, 12:42:30 pm »
a few tips.
someone already mentioned the crush...   

cut the grain after you've done your initial pull and before you sparge(slice it like a pie)

use more grain:) sry had to

also, when you think you've pulled all the wort off the grain that is there... wait a few...   go back and wala.. there's more... and it's highly concentrated in sugars...

adding a little 6-row or a little higher ph tend to yield better efficiency

how fresh is your grain(this is a big one)...  the longer it sits, and in particular if too much moisture gets to it, it loses some of it's diastitic power...   make sure you're purchasing your grain from a place that turns over a lot of grain...

decoction mashing is another possible solution...

Offline chinaski

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2016, 08:35:01 pm »
Another experienced batch-sparger here, but with a slightly different recommendation on your mill settings- pick a setting and stick with it if you can.  I'm sure that northern brewer does what makes sense for a retailer to do- have a coarse crush on the store mill so customers don't complain about stuck sparges!  If you can adjust their mill- great!  But try and come up with a way to measure the setting (a gap gauge works) so you can repeat the same crush with each batch you crush.  This will help you nail down your efficiency so you can adjust any recipe accordingly.  Otherwise, you'll always be futzing around with what pre-boil gravity you have.  Consistency in your efficiency is more important than the magnitude of the efficiency- i.e. getting 65% every time is better than getting somewhere between 75 and 90% efficiency on an inconsistent basis.

Brew on!

Offline euge

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2016, 09:12:02 pm »
Time to research grain mills. 8) 

FWIW I've started ripping the malt through first at the widest gap and then again closed as far as it will go. Very consistent uniformly small nits, large husks and minimal flour.

Very satisfied with this crush.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. -Richard P. Feynman

Laws are spider-webs, which catch the little flies, but cannot hold the big ones. -Anacharsis

Offline TKaiser

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2016, 05:41:06 am »
Thanks everyone. Lots of good tips here. I'll probably start with a finer crush on the grain, really smash the hell out of it and increase my mash water volume slightly to see if that helps. Going to try my hand at this again next weekend so I'll post the numbers for the recipe and what I actually get.

Thanks again!
Cheers,
-Tom

Offline leejoreilly

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #20 on: March 20, 2016, 08:39:10 am »
While I fully agree with the recommendations on crush, etc., one area you might want to look at is how you calculate your expected OG. For example, I use BeerSmith 2, and experience tells me that my "Total Efficiency" should be set to around 70% or so, for the 1.050 - 1.070 beers that I brew most often. That number matches my current process well - I used to be down around 62 - 65 % when I first started doing all grain, but improved as I fine-tuned. If I would set my efficiency to 80-85% or so, I would easily read an "expected OG" around 10 points higher than I'm really likely to get.

Offline denny

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #21 on: March 20, 2016, 09:41:48 am »
Time to research grain mills. 8) 

FWIW I've started ripping the malt through first at the widest gap and then again closed as far as it will go. Very consistent uniformly small nits, large husks and minimal flour.

Very satisfied with this crush.

Sounds great, but too much work!  I just set my gap about as tight as it will go and haven't changed it in 15 years.  Average 83% efficiency.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline euge

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #22 on: March 20, 2016, 09:47:52 am »
I thought it would be as well, Denny.

Double crushing actually works faster- takes half the time a single-pass would with a closed-down gap. I was shocked at how much better it worked... for me.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. -Richard P. Feynman

Laws are spider-webs, which catch the little flies, but cannot hold the big ones. -Anacharsis

Offline denny

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #23 on: March 20, 2016, 10:17:50 am »
I thought it would be as well, Denny.

Double crushing actually works faster- takes half the time a single-pass would with a closed-down gap. I was shocked at how much better it worked... for me.

Sounds like you've got a good plan and it works for you.  Just like mine works for me.  Good to discuss different experiences so people have a range of opinions an ideas!
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline euge

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #24 on: March 20, 2016, 11:11:04 am »
I thought it would be as well, Denny.

Double crushing actually works faster- takes half the time a single-pass would with a closed-down gap. I was shocked at how much better it worked... for me.

Sounds like you've got a good plan and it works for you.  Just like mine works for me.  Good to discuss different experiences so people have a range of opinions an ideas!

We all have you to thank for showing us the way Denny! :)

And we've run with it.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. -Richard P. Feynman

Laws are spider-webs, which catch the little flies, but cannot hold the big ones. -Anacharsis

Offline salcedo

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #25 on: March 22, 2016, 07:55:18 am »
What styles are you brewing? Can you list your grain bill, and expected OG? Expecting a 1.050 and only achieving 1.030 is much different than expecting 1.095 and achieving 1.080.

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Offline TKaiser

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Re: New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #26 on: March 22, 2016, 04:43:48 pm »
What styles are you brewing? Can you list your grain bill, and expected OG? Expecting a 1.050 and only achieving 1.030 is much different than expecting 1.095 and achieving 1.080.

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I do mostly Pale Ales and IPA. The last batch I attempted was a New Belgium Citradelic clone. Simple grain bill, 12lbs of 2 row and 1/2lb of crystal 120L. 5.5 gallons to fermenter was estimated at 1.059, actual was 1.037 after topping up with 1.5 gallons.
Cheers,
-Tom

Offline tommymorris

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New to all grain, need help hitting gravity!
« Reply #27 on: March 22, 2016, 09:14:13 pm »
What styles are you brewing? Can you list your grain bill, and expected OG? Expecting a 1.050 and only achieving 1.030 is much different than expecting 1.095 and achieving 1.080.

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I do mostly Pale Ales and IPA. The last batch I attempted was a New Belgium Citradelic clone. Simple grain bill, 12lbs of 2 row and 1/2lb of crystal 120L. 5.5 gallons to fermenter was estimated at 1.059, actual was 1.037 after topping up with 1.5 gallons.
Unless you have a huge boil off rate it sounds like you are not using enough water (based on topping up to get 5.5 gallons). Either your mash is too thin or you aren't sparging with enough water or both. For a 5.5 gallon batch you should have 6.5-7 gallons before boiling and 1-1.5 gallons boil off in an hour boil.

Not sparging enough could lead to poor efficiency.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2016, 09:30:38 pm by alestateyall »