Author Topic: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions  (Read 9730 times)

Offline 2brew559

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #15 on: May 12, 2016, 11:21:06 am »
Everyone,


WOW  everyone on here is awesome!   

Awe man its too late!!!  I made my Wlp005 starter last night, before I read all the comments here regarding the yeast choice.  :(    Oh well next bitter Ill def use the 002 as everyone suggests!  :)

I'm going to get the grains/ Grist  this evening  for the Bitter so ill take the suggestions and simplify as everyone has suggested. I was on fence anyways on the Flaked barley and also lower the Crystal amount

Ill raise the IBU'S a tad as suggested!

Everyone THANK YOU!   :)   

If all you great brewers put your knowledge together,  man You'd have the worlds biggest & best Brewery ever!  Ill be president/ CEO..LOL  Ok we can negotiate the president part... ;)


Ill be back once i revise this Bitter beer!




JUST A REGULAR GUY WHO BREWS!
Aplaudir Amigos Y Amigas  :)

Offline brewinhard

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #16 on: May 12, 2016, 03:18:11 pm »
Everyone,


WOW  everyone on here is awesome!   

Awe man its too late!!!  I made my Wlp005 starter last night, before I read all the comments here regarding the yeast choice.  :(    Oh well next bitter Ill def use the 002 as everyone suggests!  :)

I'm going to get the grains/ Grist  this evening  for the Bitter so ill take the suggestions and simplify as everyone has suggested. I was on fence anyways on the Flaked barley and also lower the Crystal amount

Ill raise the IBU'S a tad as suggested!

Everyone THANK YOU!   :)   

If all you great brewers put your knowledge together,  man You'd have the worlds biggest & best Brewery ever!  Ill be president/ CEO..LOL  Ok we can negotiate the president part... ;)


Ill be back once i revise this Bitter beer!

This is a FANTASTIC forum with lots of people sharing their knowledge and expertise. 

BTW, I just want to be the official taste tester if you are the president... ;)

Offline 2brew559

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #17 on: May 12, 2016, 03:31:21 pm »
Everyone,


WOW  everyone on here is awesome!   

Awe man its too late!!!  I made my Wlp005 starter last night, before I read all the comments here regarding the yeast choice.  :(    Oh well next bitter Ill def use the 002 as everyone suggests!  :)

I'm going to get the grains/ Grist  this evening  for the Bitter so ill take the suggestions and simplify as everyone has suggested. I was on fence anyways on the Flaked barley and also lower the Crystal amount

Ill raise the IBU'S a tad as suggested!

Everyone THANK YOU!   :)   

If all you great brewers put your knowledge together,  man You'd have the worlds biggest & best Brewery ever!  Ill be president/ CEO..LOL  Ok we can negotiate the president part... ;)


Ill be back once i revise this Bitter beer!

This is a FANTASTIC forum with lots of people sharing their knowledge and expertise. 

BTW, I just want to be the official taste tester if you are the president... ;)
Official taster..dang you are one smart brewer :) Cheers everyone!

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

JUST A REGULAR GUY WHO BREWS!
Aplaudir Amigos Y Amigas  :)

Offline charles1968

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #18 on: May 12, 2016, 04:54:49 pm »
I think either WLP002 or WLP005 were the original yeast choices.

Sorry, missed that when I skim-read. Either would do the job. Yeast choice is very subjective. Either way I would ferment a touch on the warm side so it isn't clean tasting.

Offline charles1968

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #19 on: May 12, 2016, 05:01:55 pm »
Other brewers who do a ton more British ale brewing than I do have even said you could make a tasty bitter with a SMaSH of: MO + EKG. Just make sure to abuse that yeast a bit to get the character out of it.

Yes 100% MO makes very nice bitter, aka "golden ale". Hopback Summer Lightning is a good example.


Offline Saccharomyces

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #20 on: May 12, 2016, 07:56:41 pm »
I rarely use much in the way of crystal malt over 8L in my British-style ales.  I use 1 to 2% pale chocolate for color and a unique flavor addition.  I also use a lot of torrified wheat.

A lot of the stuff that we get in a bottle on this side of the pond is old; therefore, the hops have diminished and the beer takes on a caramelly aroma and flavor.   For those who are planning to attend HomebrewCon, the Pratt Street Ale House is a brewpub across the street from the convention center (see http://www.prattstreetalehouse.com and http://www.prattstreetalehouse.com/cms/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/OD-Bev-Menu-2016.pdf).  This brewpub started out with a Peter Austin designed brewhouse that was shipped to Baltimore from the UK and installed by Alan Pugsley.  From what I understand, Oliver Brewing Company (the brewing side of the brewpub) still uses the true-blue multi-strain Ringwood culture in the the new larger brewery that they built offsite (see http://oliverbrewingco.com/about).  Some of Oliver's beers are served on cask using beer engines at Pratt Street Ale House.  The head brewer Steve Jones is English, so the beer there is about as authentic as one is going to get on this side of the pond.

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #21 on: May 12, 2016, 08:39:40 pm »
I rarely use much in the way of crystal malt over 8L in my British-style ales.  I use 1 to 2% pale chocolate for color and a unique flavor addition.  I also use a lot of torrified wheat.

A lot of the stuff that we get in a bottle on this side of the pond is old; therefore, the hops have diminished and the beer takes on a caramelly aroma and flavor.   For those who are planning to attend HomebrewCon, the Pratt Street Ale House is a brewpub across the street from the convention center (see http://www.prattstreetalehouse.com and http://www.prattstreetalehouse.com/cms/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/OD-Bev-Menu-2016.pdf).  This brewpub started out with a Peter Austin designed brewhouse that was shipped to Baltimore from the UK and installed by Alan Pugsley.  From what I understand, Oliver Brewing Company (the brewing side of the brewpub) still uses the true-blue multi-strain Ringwood culture in the the new larger brewery that they built offsite (see http://oliverbrewingco.com/about).  Some of Oliver's beers are served on cask using beer engines at Pratt Street Ale House.  The head brewer Steve Jones is English, so the beer there is about as authentic as one is going to get on this side of the pond.
I have been using torrified wheat and like it. Some Golden syrup is nice. I need to make my own invert 2 and 3 to play with.

We will try that brewpub you recommend!
« Last Edit: May 13, 2016, 05:34:21 am by hopfenundmalz »
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Offline troybinso

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #22 on: May 12, 2016, 10:26:07 pm »
I have to disagree with a British Bitter beer being yeast driven. For me, a Bitter is just about the perfect balance of malt, hops, and yeast.

Offline charles1968

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #23 on: May 13, 2016, 01:27:44 am »
I have to disagree with a British Bitter beer being yeast driven. For me, a Bitter is just about the perfect balance of malt, hops, and yeast.

The best draft real ales have lots of yeast character, but bitters vary enormously and many have very little character. Bottled English bitters are nearly all terrible - they tend to end up an oxidized caramelly mess as Sacch says.

Offline dilluh98

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #24 on: May 13, 2016, 09:40:38 am »
I have to disagree with a British Bitter beer being yeast driven. For me, a Bitter is just about the perfect balance of malt, hops, and yeast.

This is certainly true. There's a place for yeast driven British ales (the very low alcohol ones, IMO) and there's a place for what you describe: balance of all three components. A friend of mine who hates AIPA and APA because of their hop-forwardness, loved a recent ESB I gave her. She said, "wow, I can actually taste the malt!"

A local brewery makes an american amber ale that drinks just like an ESB. My wife and I never thought we'd get so excited about an amber ale but it's almost a constant in our fridge because of the excellent balance it has.

Offline stpug

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #25 on: May 13, 2016, 10:19:33 am »
I don't know what my LHBS charges for torrified wheat, but MAN is it easy to make!!! (for about $0.95/lb)

Using an air popper, put in ~3/4 cup soft white wheat berries, turned it on, and the berries were popping in about 1 minute and done popping about 15 seconds later. Gave it anywhere from 15-30 seconds more after the popping finished up and hit a nice flavor level (15 seconds was on the not-enough side [flavor is like the soft interior of bread], and 30 was on the maybe-too-much side [toasted character is like dark munich but wheat not barley], 20-25 would be about right [like lightly toasted bread before any dark spots appear]).  I snacked on a bunch because they're pretty tasty with a nice soft crunch/pop factor.

Before and after:


Edit: I must add, prior to this talk about "torrified wheat" I was under the impression that it was simply expanded raw wheat such that the starches were more accessible to the enzymes in the mash so it didn't require any extra steps to use.  I thought it was the equivalent to (almost exactly like) flaked wheat, but it a different form - I didn't realize the berries went through any kind of toasting phase.  After reading this thread, and then Candi Syrup's write-up on it (pdf link), I realized how mistaken I was (for the first time in my life :D).  Which lead me down the rabbit hole that lead to the picture I posted above. I bake lots of different bread so I happened to have some soft white wheat berries readily available, but I suspect hard red wheat berries would work much the same (although they may take a little extra time and give a little different flavor).
« Last Edit: May 13, 2016, 10:39:16 am by stpug »

Offline narcout

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #26 on: May 13, 2016, 10:58:34 am »
For those who are planning to attend HomebrewCon, the Pratt Street Ale House is a brewpub across the street from the convention center (see http://www.prattstreetalehouse.com and http://www.prattstreetalehouse.com/cms/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/OD-Bev-Menu-2016.pdf).  This brewpub started out with a Peter Austin designed brewhouse that was shipped to Baltimore from the UK and installed by Alan Pugsley.  From what I understand, Oliver Brewing Company (the brewing side of the brewpub) still uses the true-blue multi-strain Ringwood culture in the the new larger brewery that they built offsite (see http://oliverbrewingco.com/about).  Some of Oliver's beers are served on cask using beer engines at Pratt Street Ale House.  The head brewer Steve Jones is English, so the beer there is about as authentic as one is going to get on this side of the pond.

Well, I'm definitely planning on going there now. 
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Offline brewinhard

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #27 on: May 13, 2016, 11:03:12 am »
I don't know what my LHBS charges for torrified wheat, but MAN is it easy to make!!! (for about $0.95/lb)

Using an air popper, put in ~3/4 cup soft white wheat berries, turned it on, and the berries were popping in about 1 minute and done popping about 15 seconds later. Gave it anywhere from 15-30 seconds more after the popping finished up and hit a nice flavor level (15 seconds was on the not-enough side [flavor is like the soft interior of bread], and 30 was on the maybe-too-much side [toasted character is like dark munich but wheat not barley], 20-25 would be about right [like lightly toasted bread before any dark spots appear]).  I snacked on a bunch because they're pretty tasty with a nice soft crunch/pop factor.

Before and after:


Edit: I must add, prior to this talk about "torrified wheat" I was under the impression that it was simply expanded raw wheat such that the starches were more accessible to the enzymes in the mash so it didn't require any extra steps to use.  I thought it was the equivalent to (almost exactly like) flaked wheat, but it a different form - I didn't realize the berries went through any kind of toasting phase.  After reading this thread, and then Candi Syrup's write-up on it (pdf link), I realized how mistaken I was (for the first time in my life :D).  Which lead me down the rabbit hole that lead to the picture I posted above. I bake lots of different bread so I happened to have some soft white wheat berries readily available, but I suspect hard red wheat berries would work much the same (although they may take a little extra time and give a little different flavor).

This is awesome.  I am constantly amazed at the ingenuity of people on this forum. And I think I'm cool when I use my pH meter.  ::)

Offline 2brew559

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #28 on: May 13, 2016, 02:32:36 pm »
Every one :)

Well I had my grains milled.. wait that sounds Durtry..LOl

I had them ground in a mechanical system with rollers..ie grain mill..LOL 

So I went with these %'s in a 5.5 gallon batch OG 1.040 / FG 1.012
Yeast: wlp005 (sorry I had already made a PHAT starter with it! :( next time 002!

Golden promise 84%
Torrified Wheat 6.7%
UK crystal 50L 6.7%
CaraAroma 120/130L  2.5%

Fuggles 1 oz @ 60mins = 20.73 IBUS
EKG 1 oz @ 15mins = 10.29 IBUS
cascade 1 oz @ 5mins = 5.79
IBUs = 36.81 ( I upped the IBUs as suggested on here)

By the way Caraoma rocks .. don't use too much cause can be strong!  I Uses it in small amounts in my amber and  The Amber was a HIT!   

so I wanted to try nuance of that stuff in this Bitter!

Im def. next round going to take everyone super awesome suggestions and make batch no#2







« Last Edit: May 13, 2016, 02:48:04 pm by 2brew559 »
JUST A REGULAR GUY WHO BREWS!
Aplaudir Amigos Y Amigas  :)

Offline blair.streit

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Re: British Ordinary Bitter critique & suggestions
« Reply #29 on: May 13, 2016, 03:50:23 pm »
A local brewery makes an american amber ale that drinks just like an ESB. My wife and I never thought we'd get so excited about an amber ale but it's almost a constant in our fridge because of the excellent balance it has.
Are you talking about Thirsty Goat? Just curious because I saw you're in TX and feel the same way about that one.