[missnridge]

Hello all, first post on the forum. I'm located in a dry country but have hops, yeast, and water but I'm missing that key 4th ingredient. I've found some flaked rye at a local grocery store and wondering if I can use that to create a 100% rye beer. I also have some of the BSG Amylase enzyme. Some research I've done indicates that this might only be alpha-amylase. I tried to experiment with flaked rye and amylase but got just a thick goopy mess that didn't ferment at all.

The experiment:
1/2 gal water
1/2lb flaked rye
1/2 tsp amylase
Heated water and flaked rye up to 158F. Added amylase and maintained temp between 155-160 for approx 20 minutes. Poured mixture through cheesecloth. The liquid was thick and slimy (beta-glucans?). Hydrometer showed about 1.010. Pitched in some distillers yeast as I have a lot more distillers yeast then ale yeast. Checked the concoction about 3 days later and noticed no change in gravity. Let it go for another day or two with no change. Now I'm here....

Any issues with my process or is it just not gonna work? I've tested the amylase and it appears to work well converting corn starch to fermentable sugars. Just no luck with the flaked rye.

Cheers,
missnridge

[natebrews]

Just from the amounts, it seems like you didn't get squat for sugars out of it.  Most things are 38 points per pound per gallon, so you should have gotten something in the mid-high 30s instead of 10.

I've tried using amylase enzyme to do something similar before using flaked oats and had pretty poor luck.  I don't know if you might have to cook the flaked rye in some boiling water first to release the starches before you add the enzyme (like a cereal mash).

[erockrph]

Are we sure this is the same alpha-amylase we get from malted barley? Because other forms of amylase may have other optimum temperature ranges. Maybe try a multi-step mash with extra enzyme added at each step just to be sure?

The other thing I'm thinking is that the distiller's yeast may not be able to eat all the sugars produced by the amylase. I think an attenuative brewer's yeast would give you the best shot. I'd try Belle Saison/WY3711 if you have access to it, since that will eat pretty much anything.

[natebrews]

Another option for the enzyme is to just use a handful of regular 2-row in there.  There is a pile of enzyme in 2-row so you wouldn't need much.

[denny]

Another option for the enzyme is to just use a handful of regular 2-row in there.  There is a pile of enzyme in 2-row so you wouldn't need much.

Sounds like he doesn't have access to it.

[missnridge]

Thanks folks. I've heard rumors of some guys who've been able to malt their own grain here but the more knowledgeable folks I've met here think there's something sprayed on the barley or some kinda kilning process to stop the barley from malting.

Good idea on temp ranges. I'll try to run through the different amylase temp ranges to see what kind PPG I get. Might have to sacrifice some of my precious ale yeast to test the final product.

Cheers...

[Hand of Dom]

From the product description:

In mashing, Fungal α-amylase is active up to 60°-65°C(140°-149°F) and has optimal activity in the range of 52°-62°C (125°-144°F). They enzyme is completely deactivated above 70°C (158°F).

Source

Sounds like you killed the enzyme as soon as you added the 158F water.

[ajk]

I've heard rumors of some guys who've been able to malt their own grain here but the more knowledgeable folks I've met here think there's something sprayed on the barley or some kinda kilning process to stop the barley from malting.

That's a crime against nature right there.


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[missnridge]

I got the dry amylase listed here http://bsghandcraft.com/index.php/processing-aids/amylase-enzyme-formula-1-lb.html

"Breaks 1,4 linkage in starch during liquefication, producing dextrin and a small amout of maltose. Leaves 1,6 links, therefore self-limiting."

Best bet might be take a small sample out after each rest and see how much starch is still present using a little iodine.

Thanks for the ideas....

[Steve Ruch]

Another option for the enzyme is to just use a handful of regular 2-row in there.  There is a pile of enzyme in 2-row so you wouldn't need much.

Sounds like he doesn't have access to it.

Perhaps he should go with mead or cider: honey and apple juice would probably be more readily available even in a dry country.

[Matthew]

Why only a 20 minute mash? It should take 60-90 minutes and I would suggest a 145-150 mash temp.

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[PharmBrewer]

Maybe someone already posted but wonder if you could use the equivalent of Beano?

http://byo.com/body/item/181-beano-brew

[Arsuf476]

Have you considered trying kvass? The 'grain' component is bread. https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/how-to-brew/how-to-brew-russian-kvass/