[Hooper]

Is there any noticeable difference/improvement in the spunded beers?

[HoosierBrew]

Is there any noticeable difference/improvement in the spunded beers?

I will say this - I keg hop American styles, and the hop character seems to stick around much longer. Noticeably so. It comes as no surprise to anybody I'm sure that hop character is easily oxidized, and the active yeast from the end of fermentation is there to scavenge the keg. The idea transfers to any beer and serves to prevent degradation of quality from oxidation IMO.

Disclaimer- these are only my non scientific observations. I see definite merit here though.
 

 

[Phil_M]

Is there any noticeable difference/improvement in the spunded beers?

While I haven't yet spunded, (just now got everything to try it, waiting on a beer) I've noticed my naturally carbonated beers have stayed fresh longer compared to force carbed beers. Bottle or cask, only time I tried keg conditioning the batch got dumped for a separate issue.

If the active yeast scrubbing O₂ is the reason for the increased freshness, then spunding seems the next logical improvement.

Hope that helps. Is there a noticeable difference between spunded and force carbed? I'd say yes, based on my natural carbonation observations. Is spunding better than just naturally carbing the old fashioned way? Should be, but I can't say from personal experience yet.

[tommymorris]

If you are fermenting an ale at say 64F in a keg. Can you set the spunding valve at 25PSI on day 1? 25PSI at 64F yields 2.35 volumes. 

This valve recommended by Homebrewfinds can be set for up to 100 PSI.

Control Devices CR Series Brass Pressure Relief Valve, 0-100 psi Adjustable Pressure Range, 1/4" Male NPT https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007GDY3CU/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_2Y-JybHHXE00H

Homebrewfinds blog post on building a spunding valve:
http://www.homebrewfinds.com/2011/02/build-spunding-valve.html

[HoosierBrew]

Misread, Tommy. Not on day one, no. You'll end up with way too much yeast in the keg. Transferring to another keg with ideally 4(or
A tad over) points of extract left will leave enough extract to scavenge and carb without having a keg full of trub,yeast, and gunk.
 

[BrewBama]

If you are fermenting an ale at say 64F in a keg. Can you set the spunding valve at 25PSI on day 1? 25PSI at 64F yields 2.35 volumes. 

This valve recommended by Homebrewfinds can be set for up to 100 PSI.

Control Devices CR Series Brass Pressure Relief Valve, 0-100 psi Adjustable Pressure Range, 1/4" Male NPT https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007GDY3CU/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_2Y-JybHHXE00H

Homebrewfinds blog post on building a spunding valve:
http://www.homebrewfinds.com/2011/02/build-spunding-valve.html

Here's another reference FYI:

http://seanterrill.com/2015/06/25/build-a-better-spunding-valve/

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[tommymorris]

If you are fermenting an ale at say 64F in a keg. Can you set the spunding valve at 25PSI on day 1? 25PSI at 64F yields 2.35 volumes. 

This valve recommended by Homebrewfinds can be set for up to 100 PSI.

Control Devices CR Series Brass Pressure Relief Valve, 0-100 psi Adjustable Pressure Range, 1/4" Male NPT https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007GDY3CU/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_2Y-JybHHXE00H

Homebrewfinds blog post on building a spunding valve:
http://www.homebrewfinds.com/2011/02/build-spunding-valve.html

Can you set the pressure for the highest temp your beer will reach during fermentation?

For instance, if fermenting a lager with a planned diacetyl rest at 64F: can you set the pressure to 25PSI on day 1? If you ferment at 50F your beer could reach 3.1 volumes CO2 after high krausen, but, over the 2-3 days of diacetyl rest presumably the beer would loose CO2 and the carbonation would drop to 2.35 volumes CO2. When you cold crash you can leave the valve at 25PSI. Assuming cold crash at 32F, the gauge pressure in the keg will drop to 7PSI but no CO2 will be lost.

I am not sure if the spike to 3.1 volumes CO2 would leave behind any off flavors. Also, not sure if the extra dissolved CO2 will have enough time to escape from the beer during the diacetyl rest.

I may be crazy but I have been thinking about this. Might make fermentation in the keg worth while.

[natebrews]

I don't have the spunding valve on it until I transfer to the keg, usually with 6 points left or so.  I guess that maybe you could do what you are saying, but I don't know that the yeast would play nice at that pressure through the main ferment.  Additionally, you might get krausen up in the valve if the keg is too full and then you'll have to deal with that.

Are you looking to ferment under pressure, or capture the end of it to scrub oxygen and carbonate naturally?

[HoosierBrew]

I don't have the spunding valve on it until I transfer to the keg, usually with 6 points left or so.  I guess that maybe you could do what you are saying, but I don't know that the yeast would play nice at that pressure through the main ferment.  Additionally, you might get krausen up in the valve if the keg is too full and then you'll have to deal with that.

Are you looking to ferment under pressure, or capture the end of it to scrub oxygen and carbonate naturally?

Yeah, same here. Overlooked that he said from day one. As said, you don't know how a given strain will tolerate pressure from the get go (some do), but also you'd have a keg full of yeast and gunk. Waiting until there are a few points left gives the best results.

[tommymorris]

I was just asking to see what you guys thought. I haven't tried spunding yet. But it is something I want to try.

I brew 3G in 5G fermenter so I don't think I would have a problem with krausen.

But it would be a mess at transfer time and I also wondered about how the yeast would behave under high pressure.

I just thought spunding could speed carbonation this way.

[natebrews]

For sure it is nice that the beer is all carb'ed up when it is finished fermenting.  The time to get it done is pretty much the same, but then it is all ready to go.  You do get a bit of yeast that ends up needing to be run out of the keg, but that isn't a big deal. 

I also have been thinking about it for my hoppy beers from the perspective that the slight yeast activity will consume the oxygen introduced from the dry hops (in a hop bag) and then the aromas aren't being blown off since the gasses are being trapped in the beer.  I don't know how much that would matter, but it would seem to me that not blowing off that aroma would be better than having it leave the beer.

[HoosierBrew]

I also have been thinking about it for my hoppy beers from the perspective that the slight yeast activity will consume the oxygen introduced from the dry hops (in a hop bag) and then the aromas aren't being blown off since the gasses are being trapped in the beer.  I don't know how much that would matter, but it would seem to me that not blowing off that aroma would be better than having it leave the beer.

Yep, like I posted, I'm pretty encouraged by the results on my hoppy beers. Seems to be a pretty ideal way to purge the keg and the O2 from the hops, without letting the aromas blow off.

[The Beerery]

I will just add that along with all the other benefits listed here, oxygen, carbonation, etc. I will list one that often gets overlooked, and that is better foam. Here is why(IMO), Glycerol.

Yeast produce glycerol naturally which contributes to body and palatability, but I think when spunded and put under pressure, the yeast produce more, and it contributes to foam positive proteins.

[ynotbrusum]

I have the spunding valve, but I need to catch the beer soon enough.  With the lagers, they are finishing so well and quickly, that by the time I get back to them they are too far along...so, I will need to anticipate better and be prepared to move them to keg much more quickly.  Also, I have to look up priming rates, so I am ready to get the sugar water into the keg when the beer is at the right stage.  I don't see a problem with adding the sugar water through the tubing and then the out post of the keg in advance of the beer transfer, but I am wondering about the water - should it be pre-boiled, as well or will the process take care of that issue?

[natebrews]

When I add sugar I boil the sugar and water together to make sure that the sugar is all well dissolved, and I usually use as little water as I think I can get away with.  Depending on your apparatus, you might be able to get it boiling and then put it in the keg while it is still near boiling to prevent it from absorbing any oxygen before it goes into the keg.  Once it is in the keg it will cool down mighty quick, to say nothing of having the rest of the beer put on it.  That is my take on it anyway.

Also, with the spunding valve on it, the amount of sugar you use becomes a bit less important as long as you have a bit more than you need.  The pressure relief valve will set the carbonation level if there is too much sugar put into it.