Author Topic: Cider and Presevatives question  (Read 3035 times)

Offline lennyg

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Cider and Presevatives question
« on: February 05, 2017, 07:48:54 PM »
     May seen like a very elementary question, but I'll ask anyways - Could not find a definitive answer in my search -

  Is cider that contains preservatives, specifically sodium benzoate or potassium sorbate, unfermentable?

  Or is there a way past this?

  Thanks in Advance!

Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2017, 11:03:05 PM »
It generally will ferment, but the yeast will be sluggish and produce a lot of sulfur due to stress.  It can still work.  However, if you are able to find juice without preservatives, or juice your own, you will generally get more tasty results.  Try to find some no-preservative juice if you can.  For example, I believe the brand called Simply Apple which is available everywhere USA has no preservatives.  See if you can find some.
Dave

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Offline lennyg

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2017, 01:36:28 AM »
Thanks very much - I will find the brand you recommend for the subsequent batch -
Is there any advantage to double-pitching the yeast? Nutrient additions? Extra sugars. I.E. honey, brown sugar, maple syrup, molasses?
Thanks again! 
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Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2017, 01:23:31 PM »
You'll hear varying opinions on all of that.  Personally I am a purist and don't add anything to my ciders except yeast (Cote des Blancs is my favorite).  I like real cider the best all by itself.  Sugars just ferment out and add alcohol.  Nutrients, I feel, don't do a dang thing, aren't necessary.  Just pitch a little yeast and you'll get a good hard cider at around 6-6.5% ABV.  I like to ferment low and slow, close to 60 F for about 2 months.  You can rack it about once per week to keep it sweet, or leave it alone for a very dry cider.
Dave

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Offline lennyg

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2017, 09:52:13 PM »
Thanks again for you input and advice, greatly appreciated!!

Offline mindmajick

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #5 on: March 01, 2017, 03:35:11 PM »
Also.. Cheap and good for cider. Walmart has 1 gallon bottles of Musselman apple cider for four bucks each. Pretty sure simply apple is crazy expensive

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« Last Edit: March 01, 2017, 03:40:35 PM by mindmajick »

Offline mindmajick

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2017, 03:40:12 PM »
Also.. I only make CIDER these days so have experimented quite a bit. A pound of sugar will boost the alcohol without changing the flavor much.

The current batch I'm working on will top out at 11% alcohol and I'm stopping the fermentation with potassium sorbate plus campden tablets. Then back sweetening with concentrated fruit punch. This was a request for a hard punch that is easy to drink.

Using champagne yeast and should be ready in four weeks total... Only because the punch will cover any off flavors from not conditioning or doing secondary.

I also use yeast nutrients to speed up the process. Initial fermentation with the same yeast as above at the same temperature takes less than two weeks with nutrient.

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« Last Edit: March 01, 2017, 03:42:11 PM by mindmajick »

Offline denny

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2017, 04:10:44 PM »
nI hvae a cider press and have been making cider for years with juice from my own and neighbors apples.  I've experimented with a number of additions and yeasts.  Lately I've come down to just juice...no sugar, lemon, cinnamon, etc.  On the last 2 batches the only yeast I had arnd was WY1450 so that's what I used.  Kinda to my surprise they were the best batches I've ever made.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2017, 04:15:13 PM »
nI hvae a cider press and have been making cider for years with juice from my own and neighbors apples.  I've experimented with a number of additions and yeasts.  Lately I've come down to just juice...no sugar, lemon, cinnamon, etc.  On the last 2 batches the only yeast I had arnd was WY1450 so that's what I used.  Kinda to my surprise they were the best batches I've ever made.


That's what I've been doing too, Denny. Just juice , no fortification or extras. I bump up the acidity with malic and backsweeten a tad , but that's all
 
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Offline denny

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2017, 06:19:46 PM »
That's what I've been doing too, Denny. Just juice , no fortification or extras. I bump up the acidity with malic and backsweeten a tad , but that's all

I don't even do that any more.  Seems to turn out great without it, although I can probably attribute that to the apples I have.  And I highly recommend giving 1450 a shot for cider.  I never would have thought of it except it was all I had.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2017, 06:34:33 PM »
That's what I've been doing too, Denny. Just juice , no fortification or extras. I bump up the acidity with malic and backsweeten a tad , but that's all

I don't even do that any more.  Seems to turn out great without it, although I can probably attribute that to the apples I have.  And I highly recommend giving 1450 a shot for cider.  I never would have thought of it except it was all I had.



I'll do that. Never tried it in cider.
Jon H.

Offline lennyg

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Re: Cider and Presevatives question
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2017, 06:14:27 PM »
Have 2 6-gallon batches going right now - One is a batch with the cider I picked up not realizing it was loaded with preservatives - It's been going about three weeks  - very slowly.  Second batch was made with pure pasteurized cider with only ascorbic acid added.  I double pitched the yeast and it's bubbling nicely! Will be moving it to the cellar this afternoon.  Both batched received 1# of dark brown sugar and about 8 ounces of molasses, and batch #2 got a few sticks of cinnamon, just to see how it tastes.
 More projects yet to come!  We have a lot of cider planned for the spring/summer/fall season!