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Author Topic: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'  (Read 12801 times)

Offline dilluh98

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2017, 10:34:28 am »
Denny I think you mean the difference between -ate and -ite, which typically refers to the oxidation state of the non-oxygen component of the anion. "-ites" have a lower oxidation state than "-ates." Thus "ites" can be oxidized into "ates." Nitrites, nitrates, sulfites, sulfates, phosphites, phosphates, etc.

Thanks...I recalled that part.  But I thought there was something similar with "ides".

"Ide" usually refer to non-oxygen anions. Sulfide (S2-), Phosphide (P3-), nitride (N3-). Chemical nomenclature, especially the older names, have many quirks though so it's easy to get confused.

Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2017, 10:57:15 am »
The only ides I know of are the ides of March...  Beware.
It's all in the reflexes. - Jack Burton

Offline dilluh98

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2017, 11:56:18 am »
The only ides I know of are the ides of March...  Beware.

 :D

Offline brewinhard

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2017, 12:29:46 pm »
The only ides I know of are the ides of March...  Beware.

Well done!  ;)

And damn, those are just around the corner....

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2017, 12:42:45 pm »
Ok... Looks like potassium and sodiun metabisulphite are ones that have to be labeled if used as a preservative at >10ppm. Per Wikipedia, which we all know is either accurate or not.

Supposedly causes brain damage. So, that explains a lot. Or it doesnt.

The Beerery

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #20 on: February 10, 2017, 01:39:44 pm »
 If you are wary about sulfites I suggest one not look at any packaging labels on food


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Offline dilluh98

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2017, 01:43:24 pm »
If you are wary about sulfites I suggest one not look at any packaging labels on food


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Yup, you should avoid almost all dried fruit if you don't like sulfites.

Offline dilluh98

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2017, 01:52:01 pm »
If you are wary about sulfites I suggest one not look at any packaging labels on food


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Yup, you should avoid almost all dried fruit if you don't like sulfites.

I guess we shouldn't make too much light of this. It would truly suck to have an acute allergy to sulfites. Take a look at this list of foods that can contain them (although many at very low concentrations, likely):

http://www.sulfites.org/sulfite-foods/

As far as low oxygen brewing is concerned - I'm using it at minimal amounts and I am sure my process is leaky enough that a good amount of that small amount is turning into sulfate by the time I drink the beer annd I know I'm not allergic to sulfites as I regularly consume dried fruit without issue.

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #23 on: February 10, 2017, 02:04:09 pm »
Quote from: dilluh98 link=topic=28750.msg377935#msg377935

As far as low oxygen brewing is concerned - I'm using it at minimal amounts and I am sure my process is leaky enough that a good amount of that small amount is turning into sulfate by the time I drink the beer annd I know I'm not allergic to sulfites as I regularly consume dried fruit without issue.



Yeah, that's my feeling, too. I'm pretty sure the vast majority of mine is getting converted, too. It's a valid concern, though.
Jon H.

The Beerery

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #24 on: February 10, 2017, 02:06:23 pm »
If you have ever drank a macro lager, you have consumed many yeast derived sulfites.  All have a minimum of 10ppm packaged.


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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #25 on: February 10, 2017, 02:15:29 pm »
It's just a question. I honestly didn't know if this SMB was the same stuff the government says is killing us.

Tongue in cheek... I'm not sure that -hey, they put it in keystone- is a stand alone argument for me using it. Just sayin 😉

Offline stpug

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #26 on: February 10, 2017, 02:31:30 pm »
Alcohol? Yes, it's definitely the same stuff the government says is killing us.  It's a toxin for our bodies for sure, and addictive too.

Offline denny

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #27 on: February 10, 2017, 03:17:03 pm »
Denny I think you mean the difference between -ate and -ite, which typically refers to the oxidation state of the non-oxygen component of the anion. "-ites" have a lower oxidation state than "-ates." Thus "ites" can be oxidized into "ates." Nitrites, nitrates, sulfites, sulfates, phosphites, phosphates, etc.

Thanks...I recalled that part.  But I thought there was something similar with "ides".

"Ide" usually refer to non-oxygen anions. Sulfide (S2-), Phosphide (P3-), nitride (N3-). Chemical nomenclature, especially the older names, have many quirks though so it's easy to get confused.

Thanks!  My chem days are 40 years in the past.
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Offline BrewBama

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #28 on: February 10, 2017, 03:32:22 pm »
I found this on BSG website. "SMB Recommended Usage: Dosage varies when used to kill wild bacteria in must, halt fermentation, or preserve finished wines against oxidation. The addition of ΒΌ teaspoon of sodium metabisulfite to 5 gallons contributes approximately 50 ppm of free SO2.

To make a sanitizing rinse for equipment, dissolve 8 teaspoons of sodium metabisulfite into 1 gallon of water. High concentrations of sulfur dioxide gas are irritating and toxic, so use in a well ventilated area. After applying the solution to your equipment, the items must be rinsed with clean, cold water."


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narvin

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Re: Reinheitsgabot and 'Real Ale'
« Reply #29 on: February 10, 2017, 04:03:57 pm »
This sounds like some food babe BS to me.