So far in my brewing experience the closest thing I've been able to pin it to is some kind of oxidized flavor in the beer. In my own recipes, I would contribute it to oxidized cara malt (or malt in general) characteristics
After thinking about it more, my best guesses were mash pH, oxidation, or stale malts. I always read about oxidation tasting like cardboard, but I'm wondering if my perception of it is just a little different and I get this overcooked baked good flavor.
I'm going to try to really cut down on the post-fermentation aeration and see if that doesn't help.
Thanks for the reply.
I was waiting so I wasn't the first guy!
Let me get you this Hogg.
“The deleterious effects of oxygen uptake at any point in the brewing cycle is well documented. The only exception to this is the oxygen introduced at the start of the fermentation. It is true that there is a considerable variation among beer drinkers both with respect to their ability to detect oxidized flavors, and with respect totheir acceptance of these notes. Yet the track record is clear in both amateur and commercial brewing: Consistently successful brewers are invariably the ones who operate low oxygen systems. For most of the twentieth century, attention was focused on oxidation occurring after the end of the fermentation-so-called cold side aeration (CSA). Concerns about CSA are well founded since there are a number of relevant mechanisms, all of which are destructive to beer flavor.”
CSA is all over in any brewing texts and a simple google search will yield countless results. However George lays it out well here:
“Methods for such optimization are covered in, for example, in the references by Bamforth (1999) and Fix (1998). Following C. D. Dalgliesch (1977), it is useful to characterize staling in terms of three basic stages:
• Stage A is the period of stable, “brewery-fresh” flavor.
• Stage B is a transition period in which a multitude of new flavor sensations can be detected.
• Stage C products are the classic flavor tones involved in beer staling.”
He goes on to list an overview of the stages, the highlights of them being:
“Stage A beer is pristine in flavor. During stage B, Dalgliesch described a decline in hop aroma, a decline in hop bitterness,an increase in “ribes aroma” (or sometimes “catty” flavor), and an increase in sweet, toffee-like, or caramel tones. The terms ribes (or currant) and catty are widely used in the United Kingdom and Scandinavia to recall overripe or spoiled fruit or vegetables. Some tasters cite a “black currant” tone (Hardwick, 1978). In truth, these terms describe a wide spectrum of negative flavors developed when beer is in stage B. Toffee or caramel flavors can come from many sources, but those associated with staling will invariably have unattractive cloying notes. These effects are enhanced by residual diacetyl and also by excess heat treatment of wort. Finally, stage C products range from papery or leathery to sherry- or vinegar-like notes.”
This is from George Fix's book Principles of Brewing Science: A Study of Serious Brewing Issues, Edition 2
Only the LAST stage of oxidation is where cardboard comes in. Simply a loss or addition of a flavor (the flavors you are describing) are also oxidation.
Cheers and good luck!