Author Topic: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig  (Read 1836 times)

Offline Wilbur

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2017, 12:13:47 PM »
Picobrew pushes the “beer you can’t get can be made at home” narrative. Personally I think that is a bit stretch.


I agree. People should buy whatever the heck they want though.
I’m not saying people shouldn’t buy it if they want. I’m saying that “selling point” is dumb.

Not if you live in say Indonesia.
Indonesia? Still plenty of places that only distribute in their state, or just the coasts.

I wonder if they would've done better to partner with More beer, northern Brewer, etc. To stock Pico packs.

Offline denny

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #16 on: September 23, 2017, 12:18:59 PM »
Indonesia? Still plenty of places that only distribute in their state, or just the coasts.

I wonder if they would've done better to partner with More beer, northern Brewer, etc. To stock Pico packs.

That implies that they're not doing well now.
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Offline Wilbur

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #17 on: September 23, 2017, 12:27:14 PM »
Indonesia? Still plenty of places that only distribute in their state, or just the coasts.

I wonder if they would've done better to partner with More beer, northern Brewer, etc. To stock Pico packs.

That implies that they're not doing well now.
That's true, I honestly have no idea how prevalent these things are. I don't know if anyone in my area that has one, although I'm not going to pretend I know all the homebrewers in my area.

Just a business choice-trade off availability for reduced profit per unit. If love to hear a talk from some of these equipment manufacturers, similar to what some brewers have done recently (Zymurgy live maybe?).

Offline denny

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2017, 12:52:27 PM »
That's true, I honestly have no idea how prevalent these things are. I don't know if anyone in my area that has one, although I'm not going to pretend I know all the homebrewers in my area.

Just a business choice-trade off availability for reduced profit per unit. If love to hear a talk from some of these equipment manufacturers, similar to what some brewers have done recently (Zymurgy live maybe?).

Although I can't really say much, I can tell you that there are a lot more pout there than you may be seeing.  If you look at only the US market, you're seeing only a fraction if the units sold.  Also, I'm pretty sure Paks are made as they're ordered to keep them fresh.  That would make ot tough for someone like Morebeer to stock them.
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Offline Wilbur

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2017, 08:29:00 PM »
That's true, I honestly have no idea how prevalent these things are. I don't know if anyone in my area that has one, although I'm not going to pretend I know all the homebrewers in my area.

Just a business choice-trade off availability for reduced profit per unit. If love to hear a talk from some of these equipment manufacturers, similar to what some brewers have done recently (Zymurgy live maybe?).

Although I can't really say much, I can tell you that there are a lot more pout there than you may be seeing.  If you look at only the US market, you're seeing only a fraction if the units sold.  Also, I'm pretty sure Paks are made as they're ordered to keep them fresh.  That would make ot tough for someone like Morebeer to stock them.
No nitrogen flush and seal? It does keep inventory low anyway, I asked wonder how long some of those Brewers best kits sit around.

Keep talking engineering to me Denny... Sometimes I think the real reason I can't buy one I'd take it apart and void the warranty... Might have to see if I can get a tour next time I'm in that region.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2017, 08:31:17 PM by Wilbur »

Offline denny

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2017, 08:48:26 AM »
That's true, I honestly have no idea how prevalent these things are. I don't know if anyone in my area that has one, although I'm not going to pretend I know all the homebrewers in my area.

Just a business choice-trade off availability for reduced profit per unit. If love to hear a talk from some of these equipment manufacturers, similar to what some brewers have done recently (Zymurgy live maybe?).

Although I can't really say much, I can tell you that there are a lot more pout there than you may be seeing.  If you look at only the US market, you're seeing only a fraction if the units sold.  Also, I'm pretty sure Paks are made as they're ordered to keep them fresh.  That would make ot tough for someone like Morebeer to stock them.
No nitrogen flush and seal? It does keep inventory low anyway, I asked wonder how long some of those Brewers best kits sit around.

Keep talking engineering to me Denny... Sometimes I think the real reason I can't buy one I'd take it apart and void the warranty... Might have to see if I can get a tour next time I'm in that region.

I'm an electronics engineer myself, so I know what you mean!  When I got the Zymatic I immediately wanted to take it apart.  I finally decided I'd just screw something up, though.

Picobrew is usually very open to tours.  If you're gonna be in the area, let me know and I'll put you in touch.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline ethinson

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #21 on: September 25, 2017, 05:00:33 AM »
I have a Zymatic and it is a lot of fun but, after dozens of batches I can attest I really feel I make better beer on my old 12 gallon homebrew system. I can't understand the sense in "pico paks" unless you are just very rich and don't know what to do with your money.

Keurig is just pure idiocy IMO. My mom bought me one years ago and after I used the initial pods I strictly used it for hot water until it died. OTOH I actually like to drink GOOD coffee so there's that.

We had Keurigs at a former job and after a while it struck me how wasteful they are.  We live in such a "disposable" society and most people don't even notice it... You can recycle the cups but you have to do a lot of work to remove the filter and grounds before you can.  Plus, making real coffee is not hard...

To me, and this is just my personal opinion, the automatic systems like the Zymatic and Pico to me feel more like a coffee maker and less like brewing.  I enjoy being more involved in the process, but to each their own.  I am intrigued by the thought of making it easier for me in my tiny kitchen, but I think the furthest I would automate would be a grainfather to help with mashing. As it stands now, I don't do all grain and I don't mash.
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Offline erockrph

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #22 on: September 25, 2017, 07:44:42 AM »
I have a Zymatic and it is a lot of fun but, after dozens of batches I can attest I really feel I make better beer on my old 12 gallon homebrew system. I can't understand the sense in "pico paks" unless you are just very rich and don't know what to do with your money.

Keurig is just pure idiocy IMO. My mom bought me one years ago and after I used the initial pods I strictly used it for hot water until it died. OTOH I actually like to drink GOOD coffee so there's that.

We had Keurigs at a former job and after a while it struck me how wasteful they are.  We live in such a "disposable" society and most people don't even notice it... You can recycle the cups but you have to do a lot of work to remove the filter and grounds before you can.  Plus, making real coffee is not hard...

To me, and this is just my personal opinion, the automatic systems like the Zymatic and Pico to me feel more like a coffee maker and less like brewing.  I enjoy being more involved in the process, but to each their own.  I am intrigued by the thought of making it easier for me in my tiny kitchen, but I think the furthest I would automate would be a grainfather to help with mashing. As it stands now, I don't do all grain and I don't mash.
I understand the sentiment, but in the end it's all about what you enjoy with the hobby. For me, it's tinkering with new ideas and recipe design. If I was sure I was going to get similar quality results compared to my current setup, then the Zymatic would be perfect for me (the Pico, not so much). I enjoy the brewing process, but I don't have the time to brew as often as I'd like. Something like the Zymatic would let me control recipe design, but free me up during the actual brewing process.

I'm the same way with Keurig. Sure, I prefer good coffee, but a Keurig is quick and keeps me out of the drive-thru in the morning. I only drink one cup a day, so the portion is just right, too. Thankfully, I've discovered that cold brew is just as quick and lets me drink better coffee. I'm seriously considering turning one of my kegerator taps to a nitro coffee tap.
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Offline denny

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #23 on: September 25, 2017, 08:38:12 AM »
To me, and this is just my personal opinion, the automatic systems like the Zymatic and Pico to me feel more like a coffee maker and less like brewing.  I enjoy being more involved in the process, but to each their own.  I am intrigued by the thought of making it easier for me in my tiny kitchen, but I think the furthest I would automate would be a grainfather to help with mashing. As it stands now, I don't do all grain and I don't mash.

I used to think the same thing.  When I saw the ads for the Zymatic, my first response was "DO NOT WANT!".  Then I tried one and my attitude reversed.  Maybe if you actually tried one (not suggesting you buy one, just hypothetical) you might change your mind also.
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Offline ethinson

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Re: Product Development, Homebrewing, and Keurig
« Reply #24 on: September 25, 2017, 01:35:16 PM »
To me, and this is just my personal opinion, the automatic systems like the Zymatic and Pico to me feel more like a coffee maker and less like brewing.  I enjoy being more involved in the process, but to each their own.  I am intrigued by the thought of making it easier for me in my tiny kitchen, but I think the furthest I would automate would be a grainfather to help with mashing. As it stands now, I don't do all grain and I don't mash.

I used to think the same thing.  When I saw the ads for the Zymatic, my first response was "DO NOT WANT!".  Then I tried one and my attitude reversed.  Maybe if you actually tried one (not suggesting you buy one, just hypothetical) you might change your mind also.

Oh yeah, I don't doubt that I would like it if I used one.  Listening to one of your podcasts about it did highlight some of the positive aspects about the system itself (Pico interview at HBCon I believe is what I was listening to).  At some point I may get more into other things besides the process.  Like erockrph above, my favorite part is recipe design.  The quick turnaround on one off's is appealing to a certain extent.

Also, if I'm being brutally honest, all those systems right now are cost prohibitive.  (So is a gas/ three tier/blichman type system as well).
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