Author Topic: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?  (Read 1821 times)

Offline ultravista

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Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« on: September 26, 2017, 07:12:39 PM »
I mash in a bag (MIAB) not a full BIAB. The process is mash in the bag, drain, batch sparge with about a gallon of hot water, drain again - then let the bag drain (with some squeezing) while the wort is in the kettle and heating.

Because I let the bag drain, I end-up with about 1 gallon of wort which leads to a longer boil time as the batch is over target volume.

The BIAB profiles require approximately 1 gallon less that a batch sparge profile when playing with the profiles. I've tried tweaking the BIAB profiles to require a gallon less pre-boil but I can't get it quite right.

So, is there a MIAB profile that may do what I need OR a helpful push in the right direction to create my own?

Hope this makes sense ..

Offline Stevie

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2017, 07:19:36 PM »
I would start with tweaking the grain absorption numbers in the settings.

Offline Wilbur

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2017, 07:24:58 PM »
I'm not quite sure I understand. Have you tried a normal two vessel profile? In this case you're just using a different filtering system than the normal false bottom, braided line, etc.

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Because I let the bag drain, I end-up with about 1 gallon of wort which leads to a longer boil time as the batch is over target volume.

1 gallon extra? If a normal profile doesn't work, I'd doublecheck your mash thickness and other parameters, then try adjusting the grain absorption like Stevie said.

Other thoughts: (From Beersmith)
http://beersmith.com/blog/2016/11/23/brew-in-a-bag-biab-beer-brewing-with-beersmith-software/

Quote
I want to reiterate the importance of setting the Mash Tun Addition and Lauter Tun Loss fields for your BIAB setup. The Mash Tun Addition represents recoverable space below the false bottom and the Lauter Tun Loss is non recoverable, lost volume. If you are using a conventional grain bag in a pot, these should be set to zero since the grain bag fills the entire pot and you don’t lose any wort (except to grain absorption which is already calculated) when you lift the grain bag out. However many commercially available systems do have substantial volumes below the mash tun/false bottom and if you don’t account for it you may get a thick mash.

It also looks like you could adjust the mash tun addition field. This would be 0 for a normal BIAB system, but it might be a way to add that gallon back in without changing the grain absorption rate. But this might be accurate only for a certain amount of grain.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2017, 07:36:13 PM by Wilbur »

Offline ultravista

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2017, 09:09:01 PM »
Absorption, hand't thought of that.

I believe it is because I let the bag drain over time. In the Rubbermaid cooler with graduated markings, I net at least 1 gallon of wort > 1.040. I hate to let this go.

My options are too discard, toss it in the kettle & boil longer, or boil it on the stove & concentrate it into a sticky goo. It adds a few points to the gravity at such a high concentration.

In BS, I adjusted the mash absorption from .96 to .568 to match the BIAB absorption and it brought the water requirements down about a gallon - just as the BIAB mash profile did.

Since this is only MIAB, batch sparge occurs after draining the first runnings.

This just may work.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2017, 09:25:40 PM by ultravista »

Offline Visor

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2017, 07:44:50 AM »
   You batch sparge with only 1 gallon of water for a five gallon batch?
I spent most of my money on beer, tools and guns, the rest I foolishly squandered on stupid stuff!

Offline ynotbrusum

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2017, 03:18:00 PM »
I don't know the Beersmith tinkering necessary to achieve the result in advance, but as Denny always said about batch sparging is that you run off the first batch and determine how much sparge water to add based on what was collected and what is needed for the start of the boil to get where you want in terms of final volume, knowing that there will be no more than that coming out after adding the sparge water to the saturated grains.

I do a BIAB with mash recirculation and use a simple small pan lid as a mash press to squeeze out the full measure of wort from the bag after mashing.  Over the course of a few batches, I have determined that it comes down to 14-14.125 gallons of initial strike water for most of my lagers of 1044 to 1048 OG (18-20 pounds of grain) for an 11 gallon batch after boil off and cooling.

I don't boil hard anymore, however, so YMMV.

You may just want to try to do it a few times and through trial and repeat attempts to dial in your volumes with your system.  If you brew very different styles and gravities, the math might be trickier than the trial and repeat trial approach. 

Cheers!
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Offline ultravista

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2017, 09:16:01 PM »
Thank you for the feedback.

Offline BrewBama

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2017, 06:31:47 AM »
I also do MIAB and simply made my own profile in BS. Spot on every time now.


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Offline ultravista

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2017, 06:47:20 AM »
BrewBama - will you share the BS profile? I prefer to have a working mash profile vs. adjusting overall BS settings.

Offline 802Chris

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2017, 09:30:46 AM »
I also do MIAB and simply made my own profile in BS. Spot on every time now.


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Since switching to MIAB I have done this as well. I lowered all the deadspace to 0 and kept everything else about the same, except I had to bump efficiency a little :)

I had to adjust since my first two batches after switching ended up about 3/4 of a gallon over after sparging. Turned out I just needed to add a little less strike water to compenstate and I was good to go, the calculation adjustment seems to confirm this as I'm now almost always within a point of SG.

Offline ultravista

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2017, 09:11:28 PM »
802Chris - did you adjust the grain absorption for 'normal' brewing similar to the BIAB absorption?

Offline 802Chris

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Re: Mash in a Bag (MIAB) Beersmith Mash Profiles?
« Reply #11 on: September 29, 2017, 01:17:22 PM »
802Chris - did you adjust the grain absorption for 'normal' brewing similar to the BIAB absorption?

yes, basically. I use BS mobile so what I specifically changed was the "Mash Tun Dead space" setting to zero, down from .5 gallon. Especially if you are going to squeeze or allow it to drip into the kettle, you will find that you are going to get around a half gallon more into the kettle for a typical (10-12lb grain) 5 gallon batch, thus diluting your sugars and giving you a larger pre-boil volume. at least I did.

Net result, you will need slightly less water when going to MIAB in a cooler (BrewBag style). Unfortunately everyone's system is slightly different so you will really just have to guess and check. I recommend making a few batches of a style that wont be drastically effected by the difference in volume (and subsequent gravity).