[JJeffers09]

How do you feel about very very soft water for Berliner weisse?

[kramerog]

Very soft water will make the Berliner Weisse exceedingly crushable, i.e., have very low mouthfeel, IMlimitedE. 

[JJeffers09]

Very soft water will make the Berliner Weisse exceedingly crushable, i.e., have very low mouthfeel, IMlimitedE.

Thanks, that's what I was hoping for, brew day yesterday went well.  1.033 on the nose.  I did what I probably will be called out for as 'wrong but I took us-05 and Taxmans Q3 bottle dregs that I built up to a 1L starter from a local brett beer that is said to have 13 different brett strains.

Lacto-brevis is what I plan to go with to sour after a few weeks, I have some medium toast French spirals otw in to the LHBS in about 3 weeks I plan on pitching the lactic and putting the oak in at the same time.

Anyone have some advice for me?

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[mabrungard]

You won't be creating a Berliner with that culture. Berliner is primarily a lactic beverage. Brett can bring some lactic, but not like lacto will.

I've made several Berliner's and I start with RO and minimal salts. That worked well to me.

[JJeffers09]

You won't be creating a Berliner with that culture. Berliner is primarily a lactic beverage. Brett can bring some lactic, but not like lacto will.

I've made several Berliner's and I start with RO and minimal salts. That worked well to me.

I plan on using lcto Bevis after primary

Is that a bad idea?

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[mabrungard]

Sour first, ferment second.

[JJeffers09]

Boooo, well this is going to be interesting. Any suggestions anyone? I have read traditionally lacto was added post fermentation.

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[JJeffers09]

Sour first, ferment second.

This is what I'm gonna shoot for, but I'll remember your advice in the future, thanks Martin. I would see the benefit is when it gets as sour as I want it I can pasteurize the wort and pitch hops and regular yeast to finish the brew.

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[reverseapachemaster]

Boooo, well this is going to be interesting. Any suggestions anyone? I have read traditionally lacto was added post fermentation.

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I'm not really sure how that became the "traditional" approach. What few older books I've read in English on the subject all talk about one of two processes. Either they pitched a mixed sacc/lacto culture or pitched lacto and then later added sacc. Kettle souring berliner weisse dates back to at least the late nineteenth century.

If lactic acid bacteria was added after primary fermentation it would definitely include pedio and that would only be for aged berliner weisse.

[kramerog]

There was a seminar at this year's Homebrewcon which said IIRC that Berliner Weisses traditionally were sour but not that sour, probably more like American Wilds. Kindl created a very sour lacto beer that put everybody else out of business eventually.

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[ynotbrusum]

I did a Berliner one year that was brewed around Thanksgiving and served for a Cinco de Mayo fiesta.  It was a slow lacto souring that resulted from a Sacc/lacto primary pitch.  I liked the aged nature of the sour and served the BW with Himbiersirup, Zitroensirup and Woodruff in the serving glass by a spoonful or so to taste.  All were well received, but the "crushers" were taking it straight and killed the keg in a couple hours.  I kept telling them that they were chasing a buzz that they weren't going to catch with the Berliner.  They switched to a Mexican style Vienna lager to get where they wanted to be.

Anymore, I kettle sour - it's just too easy not to do it the long way.

[James K]

Last berliner Weisse I made I used distilled water and some regular water. During the mash I added acidulated malt and I won a competition with the beer.
I have never tried to pitch a culture for a Berliner. But I would try acid malting or kettl souring.