Author Topic: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?  (Read 2441 times)

Offline theoman

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2010, 12:08:56 PM »
It's all a matter of taste, I guess. To most of us, the standard American lagers just don't have much of it.

As for the roots of these beers, I think the use of corn, rice, etc. is interesting. From what I understand, these grains were never used to make the beer cheaper, but were used in the brewers' attempts to mimic the flavors of the early European lagers, before there was such an understanding of water chemistry in brewing.

A couple years ago I had a rice beer brewed by a brewpub for a nearby sushi restaurant. I thought it was pretty darn good.

Offline dbeechum

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2010, 12:28:41 PM »
The use of rice/corn was really more in an attempt to mitigate the harsh taste and huge protein content of early American barley malt.

Apparently American malt was real crap. Then it stayed around as people developed a liking for it.
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Offline dhacker

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2010, 01:22:03 PM »
Thanks to a comment I made about my early days of drinking, my son sees to it that there is always some High Life in the refrigerator. I think it is not only refreshing on a hot day, but a good way to cleanse the palate for the homebrews I make that have lots of character. . .

It beats eating crackers . .
 
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Offline vista

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2010, 08:03:48 AM »
my dad forced me to try a Narragansett premium lager a couple of years back, it was a beer he grew up drinking in college at URI and then i believe they bellied up. i was really happy i gave it a try, it quickly replaced pabst as my go to american lager...

summer bbqs...90 degrees....humid...sure i can drink an apa but an american lager is pretty clutch....about losing the love though for american lagers, i don't mind stumbling across something like narragansett or even pabst....but something about supporting AB or MC...i don't know...
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Offline Matt B

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2010, 09:33:37 AM »
I didn't start drinking until I was 23. I know, blasphemy and how the hell did I go from not drinking to brewing my own beer? Well, up until that point growing up in rural PA, I had only had what I now refer to as american piss beer (APB) and rum. Turns out, I have a strong disliking for both. So I was convinced I just didn't like booze until I moved out to California and was introduced to good beer, good vodka and good wine. Then it was straight down hill.

My taste, personally, as this is all we're talking about here, is that APB doesn't have any, and what little there is just isn't very good. Couple that with the huge amounts of carbonation (which I'm not a fan of and one of the reasons I don't drink much soda.) I like to take small drinks of something and savor the flavor and not have it turn into a frothy mass of foam in my mouth, which APB fails on both.

I can see how many people, even those who do enjoy many different beers (at which point 100% of them will have more body and flavor) which is fine. I've even been to wedding receptions in Phoenix in the middle of summer and still gone for the water instead of the Bud. It's just not for me (un?)fortunately.

I do agree that brewing an american lager with no major flaws is very very hard. The DMS and the diacetyl is quite difficult to get down to controllable levels for us homebrewers, and the big guys have come up with some very interesting industrial scale techniques to help with that. Which is impressive and testament to the quantity they deal with and the amount of time they've been doing it.

I also believe that most americans would in fact like different beers if they would venture out and try it. But given the marketing strategies of the big guys (and they're very good at it) and their control and influence with the distributors, people just don't try. The APBs are right there BAM in your face and people just go for the old standard, which people are prone to do.


Offline nicneufeld

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #20 on: August 09, 2010, 09:06:16 AM »
I'm not against adjuncts, just against rice.
It brings nothing to the table

A good nigorizake begs to differ!  :D

But yes, I prefer my liquid rice fermented on its own than fermented in beer.

I just made a very, very delicately hopped Helles that was originally intended for a BMC-friendly family event.  Drinking it lately I find myself wishing for actual, serious flavor!  I went so far to mix in some lemonade the other day...sure a Radler may be a bit of a wimpy drink but at least it tasted like something!  :D

Offline bluesman

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #21 on: August 09, 2010, 11:40:40 AM »
I'm not against adjuncts, just against rice.
It brings nothing to the table

A good nigorizake begs to differ!  :D

But yes, I prefer my liquid rice fermented on its own than fermented in beer.

I just made a very, very delicately hopped Helles that was originally intended for a BMC-friendly family event.  Drinking it lately I find myself wishing for actual, serious flavor!  I went so far to mix in some lemonade the other day...sure a Radler may be a bit of a wimpy drink but at least it tasted like something!  :D

I've never tried brewing anything with rice so it's hard for me to pass judgement.  I am not a Bud fan but I would like to compare (blind tasting) it to an all malt lager just to understand the subtle nuances of rice and barley.
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Offline euge

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #22 on: August 09, 2010, 03:04:42 PM »
My favorite Sakes are the cloudy unfiltered variations. If that was all one had to drink believe me subtleties would make themselves known.

As an adjunct in my experience rice lends a certain crispness to the brew. However it isn't all that cheap anymore, I'm not saving much using it.

IIRC, Bud doesn't use a set recipe- but uses whatever's cheapest and available at the time. Then they blend.
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Offline The Professor

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #23 on: August 09, 2010, 03:36:34 PM »
I've never tried brewing anything with rice so it's hard for me to pass judgement.  I am not a Bud fan but I would like to compare (blind tasting) it to an all malt lager just to understand the subtle nuances of rice and barley.


A pretty good indicator of the differences would be a side by side tasting of a few products from a single brewer
...in this case I recommend the much beloved AB-InBev   :o :P 

Bud (rice)
Busch (still made with corn, I believe)
Michelob (all malt).

Seems such a session would tell the tale quite effectively!
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Offline beerrat

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #24 on: August 09, 2010, 05:37:33 PM »
As I sit here drinking a can of Old Style it made me wonder...Why are there so many negative comments about these beers? Have we forgotten our roots? Or is it really crap beer? I know we weren't all drinking  Chimay Bleue right out of high school. I agree 100% that these beers don't touch a good micro or homebrew, but are they really that bad?

I guess it depends upon whose lager.  I've certainly enjoyed an Old Style at Wrigley field, and my local Yuengling Lager is perfect with a pizza.  I've had a number of region American lagers that really hit the spot.  As for Bud-Miller-Coor, not a chance of me to drink.  Any beers that require my attention with a vortex bottle, cold indicator cans, see thru boxes, or some other non digestible feature surely is not worried about the taste aspect.  Hence my negativity, anyway against mass produced American lagers.
I've brewed an American lager and enjoyed it.  BMC crowd thought was too heavy - he he he.

Offline weithman5

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #25 on: August 09, 2010, 06:10:12 PM »
i like bud, i like busch, i like the old schlitz malt liquor.  do i reach for them often.  not much but they have their time and place.  i would just as well drink water out of the shower head before i spent money on a perrier.  and just because it is brewed by a small craft brewery it can still suck.  i routinely give stuff away that i won't drink. 
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Offline thirsty

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #26 on: August 09, 2010, 08:56:13 PM »
Much like Wonder Bread and Cheeze Whiz, mega corporate brew has it's place. I don't want to eat or drink them often, but it's good to have them around when I'm in the mood for a cheeze whiz sandwich and and an ice cold bud lite.

 

Offline nicneufeld

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Re: What's with all the negativity against the Standard American Lagers?
« Reply #27 on: August 10, 2010, 08:04:58 AM »
My favorite Sakes are the cloudy unfiltered variations. If that was all one had to drink believe me subtleties would make themselves known.

I agree, those are the nigori type.  They have an almost fruity, sweet complexity to them.  I need to get another bottle and queue up a bunch of my favorite Kurosawa movies!