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Author Topic: Double Mash  (Read 18117 times)

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #75 on: March 13, 2018, 06:21:34 pm »
I'm by no means an expert on dry yeast. But I think I would hydrate it and pitch it to 1L of oxygenated 1.040 on the morning of brew day. Pitch that to my oxygenated wort that evening.

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #76 on: March 15, 2018, 02:51:46 pm »
Update:

The American Barleywine/IIIPA is really impressive. FG tapering off. Today it's at 5.8°P! Who would have thought that an 11.5% abv beer with no sugar, would reach 77.4% ADF in 10 days using just an active 1200ml starter? Amazing

The Imperial Stout is close behind at 6.4°P 10% abv and 73% ADF and appears to have reached terminal gravity in just 9 days!

Especially when you consider they started life at 60F
« Last Edit: March 15, 2018, 03:07:43 pm by klickitat jim »

Offline Robert

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #77 on: March 16, 2018, 07:17:55 am »
Update:

The American Barleywine/IIIPA is really impressive. FG tapering off. Today it's at 5.8°P! Who would have thought that an 11.5% abv beer with no sugar, would reach 77.4% ADF in 10 days using just an active 1200ml starter? Amazing

The Imperial Stout is close behind at 6.4°P 10% abv and 73% ADF and appears to have reached terminal gravity in just 9 days!

Especially when you consider they started life at 60F
Some nice validation for your vitality method, I acknowledge!
Rob Stein
Akron, Ohio

I'd rather have questions I can't answer than answers I can't question.

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #78 on: March 17, 2018, 05:44:25 pm »
Day 12, IIIPA is now at 5.4°P or 1.021
Krausen dropping,  we may have arrived.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2018, 06:02:25 pm by klickitat jim »

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #79 on: March 21, 2018, 10:56:48 pm »
Day 12, IIIPA is now at 5.4°P or 1.021
Krausen dropping,  we may have arrived.
Barleywine "IIIPA" actually finished at 5.8°P. 5.4 was operator error. Even still, pretty impressive

Big Monk

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #80 on: April 14, 2018, 06:57:00 pm »
It doesn't look like it'd be too bad for BIAB honestly. Did you do it on a 3 vessel or BIAB? How'd you calculate the second acid addition? Kettle size? I have a 10 gallon I brew 6 gallon batches on, so I might be able to get maybe 4.5 gallons if I try this. Wait, am I trying this?
Not BIAB but two vessel no sparge. 14 gallon kettles.

To calculate acid, use your total water and the total grain for total acid. Then calculate total water and 1st Mash grains only for 1st Mash acid. Second mash acid is total acid minus first mash acid. Mine was 3.5ml lactic total, and .5ml for first mash, leaving 3ml for second mash.

Can you elaborate a bit, now that you have a few of these double mashed under your belt, on the pH prediction method you are using? All the gory details if you have the time.

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #81 on: April 15, 2018, 02:02:30 am »
It doesn't look like it'd be too bad for BIAB honestly. Did you do it on a 3 vessel or BIAB? How'd you calculate the second acid addition? Kettle size? I have a 10 gallon I brew 6 gallon batches on, so I might be able to get maybe 4.5 gallons if I try this. Wait, am I trying this?
Not BIAB but two vessel no sparge. 14 gallon kettles.

To calculate acid, use your total water and the total grain for total acid. Then calculate total water and 1st Mash grains only for 1st Mash acid. Second mash acid is total acid minus first mash acid. Mine was 3.5ml lactic total, and .5ml for first mash, leaving 3ml for second mash.

Can you elaborate a bit, now that you have a few of these double mashed under your belt, on the pH prediction method you are using? All the gory details if you have the time.

I use Brewer's Friend. So... I build my recipe, then calculate what salts and acid I need for the full grain bill. I start with all the water needed, there is no second adition of water. Then in the water calculator I cut the grain bill in half and recalculate what acid I need for the first mash. The amount I use for the second mash is total acid minus first mash acid.

I have checked two different batches with a pH meter at first and second mash and it hits the target.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 02:05:11 am by klickitat jim »

Big Monk

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #82 on: April 15, 2018, 10:44:37 am »
It doesn't look like it'd be too bad for BIAB honestly. Did you do it on a 3 vessel or BIAB? How'd you calculate the second acid addition? Kettle size? I have a 10 gallon I brew 6 gallon batches on, so I might be able to get maybe 4.5 gallons if I try this. Wait, am I trying this?
Not BIAB but two vessel no sparge. 14 gallon kettles.

To calculate acid, use your total water and the total grain for total acid. Then calculate total water and 1st Mash grains only for 1st Mash acid. Second mash acid is total acid minus first mash acid. Mine was 3.5ml lactic total, and .5ml for first mash, leaving 3ml for second mash.

Can you elaborate a bit, now that you have a few of these double mashed under your belt, on the pH prediction method you are using? All the gory details if you have the time.

I use Brewer's Friend. So... I build my recipe, then calculate what salts and acid I need for the full grain bill. I start with all the water needed, there is no second adition of water. Then in the water calculator I cut the grain bill in half and recalculate what acid I need for the first mash. The amount I use for the second mash is total acid minus first mash acid.

I have checked two different batches with a pH meter at first and second mash and it hits the target.

As far as recipe design is concerned, you are inputting it as a full recipe and just splitting in two? So figure 50% of the gravity for the full batch from the first runoff?

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #83 on: April 15, 2018, 04:31:07 pm »
It doesn't look like it'd be too bad for BIAB honestly. Did you do it on a 3 vessel or BIAB? How'd you calculate the second acid addition? Kettle size? I have a 10 gallon I brew 6 gallon batches on, so I might be able to get maybe 4.5 gallons if I try this. Wait, am I trying this?
Not BIAB but two vessel no sparge. 14 gallon kettles.

To calculate acid, use your total water and the total grain for total acid. Then calculate total water and 1st Mash grains only for 1st Mash acid. Second mash acid is total acid minus first mash acid. Mine was 3.5ml lactic total, and .5ml for first mash, leaving 3ml for second mash.

Can you elaborate a bit, now that you have a few of these double mashed under your belt, on the pH prediction method you are using? All the gory details if you have the time.

I use Brewer's Friend. So... I build my recipe, then calculate what salts and acid I need for the full grain bill. I start with all the water needed, there is no second adition of water. Then in the water calculator I cut the grain bill in half and recalculate what acid I need for the first mash. The amount I use for the second mash is total acid minus first mash acid.

I have checked two different batches with a pH meter at first and second mash and it hits the target.

As far as recipe design is concerned, you are inputting it as a full recipe and just splitting in two? So figure 50% of the gravity for the full batch from the first runoff?
Yup. For example my Barleywine was 30lbs Golden Promise and 10 gal water. I needed 8.7ml Lactic total. So 1st mash was 10 gal water, 15 lbs Golden Promise, and 3ml lactic. 45 min at 160F. Remove grain. Make temp adjust if needed. Add 5.7ml lactic and the other 15lbs Golden Promise  145F for 90 min.

Off to the boil

Big Monk

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #84 on: April 15, 2018, 06:56:30 pm »
It doesn't look like it'd be too bad for BIAB honestly. Did you do it on a 3 vessel or BIAB? How'd you calculate the second acid addition? Kettle size? I have a 10 gallon I brew 6 gallon batches on, so I might be able to get maybe 4.5 gallons if I try this. Wait, am I trying this?
Not BIAB but two vessel no sparge. 14 gallon kettles.

To calculate acid, use your total water and the total grain for total acid. Then calculate total water and 1st Mash grains only for 1st Mash acid. Second mash acid is total acid minus first mash acid. Mine was 3.5ml lactic total, and .5ml for first mash, leaving 3ml for second mash.

Can you elaborate a bit, now that you have a few of these double mashed under your belt, on the pH prediction method you are using? All the gory details if you have the time.

I use Brewer's Friend. So... I build my recipe, then calculate what salts and acid I need for the full grain bill. I start with all the water needed, there is no second adition of water. Then in the water calculator I cut the grain bill in half and recalculate what acid I need for the first mash. The amount I use for the second mash is total acid minus first mash acid.

I have checked two different batches with a pH meter at first and second mash and it hits the target.

As far as recipe design is concerned, you are inputting it as a full recipe and just splitting in two? So figure 50% of the gravity for the full batch from the first runoff?
Yup. For example my Barleywine was 30lbs Golden Promise and 10 gal water. I needed 8.7ml Lactic total. So 1st mash was 10 gal water, 15 lbs Golden Promise, and 3ml lactic. 45 min at 160F. Remove grain. Make temp adjust if needed. Add 5.7ml lactic and the other 15lbs Golden Promise  145F for 90 min.

Off to the boil

Could be cool even for regular gravity beers. You can do the α first/β second schedule and even use different pH because of the physically separate mashes.



Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #85 on: April 16, 2018, 04:33:36 am »
Yup I suppose so

Offline Robert

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #86 on: April 16, 2018, 05:39:12 am »
Erockrph talked about having done something like that fifty or so posts ago to get a well attenuated big beer.
Rob Stein
Akron, Ohio

I'd rather have questions I can't answer than answers I can't question.

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #87 on: April 16, 2018, 05:45:22 am »
Erockrph talked about having done something like that fifty or so posts ago to get a well attenuated big beer.
That's who I got it from

Big Monk

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #88 on: April 16, 2018, 06:49:36 am »
Erockrph talked about having done something like that fifty or so posts ago to get a well attenuated big beer.

I'm not talking about just big beers though. This could be a good method for normal beers for people who have a desired to approximate step mashing without the unreliable infusion equations when cooler mashing. It's as easy as conducting a 30-45 minute single infusion at 162 and then an additional 30-45 minute single infusion at 17-149 ish.

Much more reliable then over or under shooting with boiling infusions.

If peoples antennae arent up over this, they should be. Very cool stuff.

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Double Mash
« Reply #89 on: April 16, 2018, 06:52:51 am »
Reverse step mash, or recoction?

Double Mash as you would a big beer, but less volume. Then dilute to desired prevail volume and gravity
« Last Edit: April 16, 2018, 06:55:35 am by klickitat jim »