Author Topic: Closed transfer  (Read 7903 times)

Offline coolman26

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #60 on: February 23, 2018, 03:35:23 PM »
Jim, you use Iodophor to sanitize?  I am considering a switch from Star San because I read it doesn’t kill everything. Your thoughts?


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The one negative of Iodophor is it doesn’t last nearly as long as Starsan. Iodophor seems to last about 24-48 hours. Starsan can stay in a bucket for weeks or months.

I use both. But Starsan has never let me down and I am not sure I will replace my Iodophor when it runs out.
I will now use Iodophor for keg purging. I also use it for my flasks and starters. I also am now going to use it periodically on my fermenters. I’ve never had an issue with StarSan either.


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Offline Robert

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #61 on: February 25, 2018, 01:32:24 AM »
Here's my new setup, ready for this weekend's brew!  Will be completely closed after pitching right through serving.  For closed transfer it's gas in the top and jumper from the bottling spigot, which I attached to Nor Cal's threaded port with a 304 stainless reducer.  Kitchen thermometer probe is secured in the thermowell with a rubber grommet.  Nor Cal were super helpful!  Links to pics of dubious photographic quality:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/14XIbqnbzuS8lNODjsIaVTWordwC-MVZi/view?usp=drivesdk

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tVrNvNHXwUhzE9NWglz-fqFOePAWUVGq/view?usp=drivesdk

EDIT stillage was needed because of extension of the port and spigot, this would be the case with anything using their accessories on the 30 liter.

I have the port at 45° So the dip tube is positioned to leave ~2 qts behind for yeast harvesting.

Got the first 6 gal in the new fermenter today!  One thing that occurred to me is that the plastic will be slightly more insulating than glass carboys (in the fridge, bringing it down the last few degrees from wort chiller temp to lager pitching temp took maybe a little longer.)  I've set the fridge thermostat a hair lower than usual and I'll see how it goes. I am really excited about this setup.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1gzzQ9vDVWFMUIDdm8Mz1wd2HTlvNrmRI/view?usp=drivesdk
« Last Edit: March 04, 2018, 12:20:20 AM by Robert »
Rob Stein
Akron, Ohio

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Offline metron-brewer

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #62 on: February 28, 2018, 05:59:27 PM »
Here is my final solution. The one I'm getting, the racking cane will actually have a liquid ball lock tip though. Then a jumper from that to the liquid out post on the keg. It doesn't include the orange threaded Speidle collar but I have about 6 extras at home.

I should have it in time to keg my double mash stout, and English IPA. So from here out I'm purging by pushing out sanitizer, and closed transferring. I use Brewtan B in my light colored beers. But that's it! Don't paint me a LODO guy! Lol

Jim,
So the gas flows in around the dip tube, pressurizing the fermentor and forcing beer out the dip tube and into the keg? Are you just installing this into the fermentor when it's time to transfer or leaving it in during fermentation? How much for that setup with the ball lock out?
Ron B.
White Bear Lake, MN

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #63 on: February 28, 2018, 06:16:42 PM »
Yes, that's how it works. I instal it at the time of transfer. I bought a couple other things along with it and total bill was about $120. I think

It works great but be aware that you need to assemble it with Teflon tape once you get it, and I suggest testing it with a fermentor partially full of sanitizer before hooking it to beer. Make sure your gas in is set to about 5psi first too.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2018, 06:19:26 PM by klickitat jim »

Offline Robert

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #64 on: February 28, 2018, 08:35:56 PM »
Here's my new setup, ready for this weekend's brew!  Will be completely closed after pitching right through serving.  For closed transfer it's gas in the top and jumper from the bottling spigot, which I attached to Nor Cal's threaded port with a 304 stainless reducer.  Kitchen thermometer probe is secured in the thermowell with a rubber grommet.  Nor Cal were super helpful!  Links to pics of dubious photographic quality:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/14XIbqnbzuS8lNODjsIaVTWordwC-MVZi/view?usp=drivesdk

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tVrNvNHXwUhzE9NWglz-fqFOePAWUVGq/view?usp=drivesdk

EDIT stillage was needed because of extension of the port and spigot, this would be the case with anything using their accessories on the 30 liter.

I have the port at 45° So the dip tube is positioned to leave ~2 qts behind for yeast harvesting.

Got the first 6 gal in the new fermenter today!  One thing that occurred to me is that the plastic will be slightly more insulating than glass carboys (in the fridge, bringing it down the last few degrees from wort chiller temp to lager pitching temp took maybe a little longer.)  I've set the fridge thermostat a hair lower than usual and I'll see how it goes. I am really excited about this setup.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1gzzQ9vDVWFMUIDdm8Mz1wd2HTlvNrmRI/view?usp=drivesdk


Came up with a further mod for my setup to stop me worrying about sanitation.  Nor cal has made me an adapter so where the spigot is in the pics I've linked, I'll have a liquid corny post!  I'll update pics next batch, I think I have a really good closed system now.
Rob Stein
Akron, Ohio

I'd rather have questions I can't answer than answers I can't question.

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #65 on: March 01, 2018, 12:05:49 AM »
That makes more sense than a spigot. To me at least. A little easier to actually clean and sanitize right before transfer. We are always told clean then sanitize. I can't bring myself to transfer through a plastic spigot that was cleaned and then sat for a month, then spritzed with starsan. A lot of people do it, and it works for them, but I just cant.

Offline Robert

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #66 on: March 01, 2018, 12:14:38 AM »
That makes more sense than a spigot. To me at least. A little easier to actually clean and sanitize right before transfer. We are always told clean then sanitize. I can't bring myself to transfer through a plastic spigot that was cleaned and then sat for a month, then spritzed with starsan. A lot of people do it, and it works for them, but I just cant.
Yep, I got the idea right before I took a sample today.  This sanitation time bomb had been eating at me.  I was ready to pull a sample and spritz the heck out of the thing and cover it with foil and then it hit me.  Got in touch with Nor Cal and a couple emails and an hour later Jaybird sent me a pic of the thing he's made.  Corny post with a 1/2" female pipe thread to go on the port.  Becky said he was jumping around the shop all excited, she thought it sounded ingenious, and I can't fathom that I might have had an original idea.  Gas in, liquid out, it's like a Speidel and a keg had a baby!

« Last Edit: March 03, 2018, 11:43:04 PM by Robert »
Rob Stein
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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #67 on: March 01, 2018, 12:17:00 AM »
Nice

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #68 on: March 02, 2018, 07:49:19 PM »
Here is my final solution. The one I'm getting, the racking cane will actually have a liquid ball lock tip though. Then a jumper from that to the liquid out post on the keg. It doesn't include the orange threaded Speidle collar but I have about 6 extras at home.

I should have it in time to keg my double mash stout, and English IPA. So from here out I'm purging by pushing out sanitizer, and closed transferring. I use Brewtan B in my light colored beers. But that's it! Don't paint me a LODO guy! Lol

Jim,
So the gas flows in around the dip tube, pressurizing the fermentor and forcing beer out the dip tube and into the keg? Are you just installing this into the fermentor when it's time to transfer or leaving it in during fermentation? How much for that setup with the ball lock out?
This is the rig in use. I'm pushing cleaner through it right now

Offline Robert

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #69 on: March 02, 2018, 10:51:54 PM »
Looks cool, Jim!  So between us we have two different approaches to this, mine modeled on a conical without the cone, yours on a Sanke.  For the benefit of others thinking about this it looks like the main pros/cons of each might be:  you have to open up your Speidel to put this in, my setup can stay closed throughout;   I have to position my "racking arm" (dip tube) before filling the fermentor and can't move it afterward, while you can position your racking tube as you go.  (As for my thermowell, you could still put one in the bottom if you wanted.)
  PS got my ball lock fitting to go on the port today, it's great.  Thanks pointing me toward Nor Cal and Speidel!
Rob Stein
Akron, Ohio

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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #70 on: March 02, 2018, 11:34:27 PM »
Awesome! The beers I kegged today were open fermented so..  already opened. On beers that I use the airlocks, I simply choose not to concern myself with the air I might get by removing the airlock and installing the transfer spear. My main objective is to not get a buggy washer lifting the fermentor. Not lifting it (disturbing it), and pulling from above the trub, equals clearer beer transfered. There's probably some minimal O2 but probably not nearly as much as I used to get with my auto siphon.

This coupled with now doing a true purge of my kegs, is probably better than before re O2. But the big benefit I see already is totally trub free beer to the keg. Before, no matter how gentle I was, there would be some. Then it would get stirred up when I move the keg to the kegerator. It would take a few more days to resettle. Pain in the butt! That's all done now though. Pretty happy with this setup.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2018, 11:37:43 PM by klickitat jim »

Offline Robert

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #71 on: March 02, 2018, 11:44:15 PM »
Yep, I used to figure I got minimal air popping on my carboy cap rig.  All closed is a bonus, the first priority was not lifting glass carboys!  I may still lift this for transfers but if I do it's a lot less weight and less danger if my back does go out halfway up (always a worry!) 
Rob Stein
Akron, Ohio

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Offline macbrews

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #72 on: March 03, 2018, 09:17:24 PM »
I have yet one more variant of a closed transfer to a Speidel. I have a cask breather, so I use it to replace the volume of beer leaving the fermenter with CO2 during a gravity transfer (you could just use pressure instead). The gas out line goes to a bucket of water and gives an audible feedback while it drains. That way I can do other tasks and not have watch it. Once the bubbling is gone, the keg is full.





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Offline Robert

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #73 on: March 03, 2018, 10:01:30 PM »
Cool!  I like the audible monitoring idea, especially as gravity transfer does leave you time to go do something else!
Rob Stein
Akron, Ohio

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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Closed transfer
« Reply #74 on: March 04, 2018, 12:34:13 AM »
Starsan and a spray bottle. And you fill the keg until beer comes out the gas in port... Thats all the more complicated this needs to be.
This is how I've been doing it. I pull the prv, because if I don't it blows back into the fermentor. Then start beer in. When beer comes out the prv I stop. Then I have a beer out stub and I push out about a pint, till I stop hearing bubbles from the gas in tube.

I shopped for a decent 0-60 scale and they are just too much and not necessary. So far so good