Author Topic: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff  (Read 3687 times)

Offline tschmidlin

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 8195
  • Redmond, WA
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #15 on: August 09, 2010, 09:33:45 PM »
How big is the pot?  That would be unusual, if the plant is in a pot that is too small it most likely lacks nutrients and thus can't produce a good crop of cones.

Is the pot sitting on dirt and have you moved it recently?  Potted hops often grow out the bottom of the pot, so the plant won't be as restricted as it might first appear.

Or maybe you're just really good at keeping up with water and fertilization and have excellent growing conditions . . .
Tom Schmidlin

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 13592
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2010, 08:28:55 AM »
I'm not sure if I have my hops in a big enough pot.  Could this by why my yield seems a little more than some?  Maybe it is running out of root room, and is concentrating on cone production?  Any thoughts?

I think you're exactly right.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

Offline alikocho

  • Brewmaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 567
  • Bristol, UK
    • View Profile
    • A Storm Brewing
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #17 on: August 10, 2010, 12:18:54 PM »
I'm not sure if I have my hops in a big enough pot.  Could this by why my yield seems a little more than some?  Maybe it is running out of root room, and is concentrating on cone production?  Any thoughts?

I think you're exactly right.

+1

You need to repot or plant this out during the winter when the plant is dormant. This sounds very much like what a plant does when it can't grow it's roots.  You could also prune the rhizome during the winter and start off a new plant.
Bristol Brewing Circle (BBC)
Bristol Craft Brewers

UK National Homebrew Competition - http://www.bristolhomebrewcompetition.org.uk/

Offline andrew

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 137
  • Lake Charles / Sweet Lake, LA
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2010, 01:59:24 PM »
Mine are pathetic. They(Golding and Willemette) were given to me as a gift, but I really don't have much space for them. I potted them both in fairly big pots but only one is alive. My cat "trimmed" them to the ground twice and now only the will are living now. Got a cage around them now but still not optimistic since I live in the burbs of Fort Lauderdale. What the cat doesn't kill the climate will.
Andrew Tingler

In bottles or on tap: porter, quad, and wit
Secondary: empty
Primary: empty
On Deck: Blackberry Stout and Irish Red

Offline jeffy

  • I spend way too much time on the AHA forum
  • ********
  • Posts: 2805
  • Tampa, Fl
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2010, 02:20:39 PM »
Mine are in their second year and seem to be very healthy, having climbed up about 16 feet and then sent shoots out all over, but I have no flowers or cones yet.  I'm envious of the photos of people harvesting already.  I want to show these to my hops and tell them, "this is what you should be doing!"
Jeff in Tampa
Jeff Gladish, Tampa (989.3, 175.1 Apparent Rennarian)
Homebrewing since 1990
AHA member since 1991, now a lifetime member
BJCP judge since 1995

Offline andrew

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 137
  • Lake Charles / Sweet Lake, LA
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2010, 02:39:55 PM »
Mine are far from that, maybe a foot and a half. It's just now really growing back. Just happy they are growing some. If I ever get one cone I may jump for joy.
Andrew Tingler

In bottles or on tap: porter, quad, and wit
Secondary: empty
Primary: empty
On Deck: Blackberry Stout and Irish Red

Offline tschmidlin

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 8195
  • Redmond, WA
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2010, 03:15:55 PM »
Mine are in their second year and seem to be very healthy, having climbed up about 16 feet and then sent shoots out all over, but I have no flowers or cones yet.  I'm envious of the photos of people harvesting already.  I want to show these to my hops and tell them, "this is what you should be doing!"
Jeff in Tampa


What varieties are you growing?  Flowering is triggered by day length and hops supposedly grow best between 35 and 55 latitude, so Tampa is far enough south that you "can't" get a good crop.  Some people still do though, so it might be dependent on the hop variety.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline richardt

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1227
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2010, 03:49:30 PM »


According to this image from Wiki, there are a lot of hops being produced in Iran and China at the same latitude as Tampa, FL. 

That would seem to suggest that climate (soil, temperature, and water) plays a role as well.

Offline mr_jeffers

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 51
  • Saco, ME
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2010, 05:23:16 PM »
This spring I planted three rhizomes, one each of Cascade, Centennial and Chinook.  It took longer than expected to get my first shoot from each rhizome, and I never got a second shoot from any of them.  The Cascade and Chinook have both grown to the top of my garage eave (10').  The top of the shoots started to hang down, so after awhile I started to train them up another string.  They both have cones, although not many.  The Centennial seems to have stalled out a little better than half way up, and even though it has side shoots, I have yet to see any developing cones.  It does get some shade from a lilac tree close by, which might explain why the other two are doing better.  I've been told not to expect much of anything the first year, so I'm trying not to get my hopes up.
Jeff Brown
Southern Maine Homebrewers

Offline hopfenundmalz

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 5954
  • Milford, MI
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2010, 05:46:57 PM »
According to this image from Wiki, there are a lot of hops being produced in Iran and China at the same latitude as Tampa, FL.  
That would seem to suggest that climate (soil, temperature, and water) plays a role as well.

Richard, that map is not so good.  It has many errors is size of the hop fields, e.g. US area is too small and in the wrong places, Germany only has a handful of hop growing areas.  Turkey and Iran do not show up on the table in the same Wiki article or in this publication below.  England only has about 3000 acres in production in Kent and Warminster, but most of Britan is green on the map.  And so on.

http://www.hmelj-giz.si/ihgc/doc/IHGC%20hop%20supply%202001-2006.pdf

I think the wrong map is linked to Wikipedia.

here are the German growing regions.
http://arzneipflanze-hopfen.de/index.php?lang=en&folder=wissen&subFolder=pflanze&file=pflanze1

edit - the units on the graph make no sense, as the yield per acre is usually about 2000 lbs.  A ha is hectare which is 2.47 acres.  kg/ha is somthing really small.




« Last Edit: August 10, 2010, 06:20:48 PM by hopfenundmalz »
Jeff Rankert
Ann Arbor Brewers Guild, AHA Member, BJCP Certified
Home-brewing, not just a hobby, it is a lifestyle!

Offline richardt

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1227
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2010, 06:40:40 PM »
Jeff,
Thanks for the feedback.  Can't believe everything on Wiki.


Offline hopfenundmalz

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 5954
  • Milford, MI
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2010, 06:49:50 PM »
Hey Richard, I go there a lot, but every now and then something makes you go, "wait a minute".

I don't even know how to contact them to point out the map not making sense.

One other point,  you can grow hops as far south as Atlanta and South Carolina.  The thing that finaly limits the southern range is not enough daylight in the summer.  I have read that the ones grown in South Africa have flood lights to make the hops think the days are longer. 

The summer solstice also is a trigger for burr/cone production.
Jeff Rankert
Ann Arbor Brewers Guild, AHA Member, BJCP Certified
Home-brewing, not just a hobby, it is a lifestyle!

Offline tschmidlin

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 8195
  • Redmond, WA
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #27 on: August 10, 2010, 07:29:49 PM »
I was looking at that map thinking it didn't quite look right, then I scrolled down and read the messages,  Nice work hopfenundmalz.

Still Richard, I think your point is accurate, climate plays a definite role in hop growing.  People DO grow successfully below 35 latitude, without using grow lights to supplement.  Chris Colby was doing some stuff a while back, it should be in BYO.  He's in Texas, and definitely below 35 degrees latitude.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline jwatkins56550

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 25
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #28 on: August 12, 2010, 06:55:38 PM »
I'm not sure if I have my hops in a big enough pot.  Could this by why my yield seems a little more than some?  Maybe it is running out of root room, and is concentrating on cone production?  Any thoughts?

I think you're exactly right.

+1

You need to repot or plant this out during the winter when the plant is dormant. This sounds very much like what a plant does when it can't grow it's roots.  You could also prune the rhizome during the winter and start off a new plant.

That's what I figured.  I think I might go ahead and plant them in the ground in the winter, don't hop roots like to grow horizontally?  Or do I have that ass backwards...

Offline tschmidlin

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 8195
  • Redmond, WA
    • View Profile
Re: Anyone Else's 1st Year Hops Not Up to Snuff
« Reply #29 on: August 12, 2010, 07:11:35 PM »
That's what I figured.  I think I might go ahead and plant them in the ground in the winter, don't hop roots like to grow horizontally?  Or do I have that ass backwards...
No, you're right, the spread horizontally.  They grow like weeds around here, so if they're happy in your area you might want to plan ahead for some sort of containment strategy.
Tom Schmidlin