Author Topic: pH  (Read 297 times)

Offline HopDen

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 28
    • View Profile
pH
« on: August 09, 2018, 10:38:30 AM »
Is it normal for the wort pH to be higher than the mash pH? I brewed a Kolsch and hit a mash pH of 5.31, when I tested the wort pH it was 5.46. I'm using a meter and it has been calibrated.

Offline Bob357

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 254
  • I can't hang with Denny. My day ends at 1.060.
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2018, 11:31:05 AM »
Sure. The grains, especially darker varieties, will lower the pH of the mash. That's why you generally don't check until the mash has stabilized.
Beer is my bucket list,

Bob357
Fallon, NV

Offline WhiteHausBrews

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 13
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2018, 12:05:04 PM »
Yeah that's normal for the pH to raise slightly, usually not going much past 5.4/5. Once fermentation kicks off you'll find it starts dropping again.

Offline mabrungard

  • Brewmaster General
  • *******
  • Posts: 2409
  • Water matters!
    • View Profile
    • Bru'n Water
Re: pH
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2018, 12:06:46 PM »
If the mash was truly homogenous, then it would be untypical for the pH of the mash wort to be lower than the kettle wort. Is it possible that the mash wasn't homogenous...not well mixed and recirculated?
Martin B
Carmel, IN

BJCP National
Foam Blowers of Indiana (FBI)

Brewing Water Information at:
https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/

Like Bru'n Water on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/Brun-Water-464551136933908/?ref=bookmarks

Offline dmtaylor

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3299
  • Two Rivers, WI
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2018, 12:13:23 PM »
Possible temperature effect?  At what temperature exactly was each measurement made?  Temperature has a significant impact on pH readings.
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline KellerBrauer

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 88
  • Bottoms Up!
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2018, 12:22:38 PM »
I agree with Mr. Brungard.  With a Kolsch, Im guessing, you needed to add chemicals to lower the pH - Lactic Acid, perhaps?  If it was not well blended, or if you didn’t allow the grains enough time before testing, it may have caused an erroneous reading.  I test my mash pH many times (3-5) and I mix the heck out of it before and after testing and before and after adding Acid.  I believe the wort pH should be the same as the mash pH.
All good things come to those who show patients and perseverance while maintaining a positive and progressive attitude. :-)

Offline HopDen

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 28
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2018, 09:42:54 PM »


Well, I believe I mixed the grains well enough. I underlet the strike water until the full amount is brought over from the HLT then mix. I have a HERMS so I do recirculate the mash.

Offline HopDen

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 28
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2018, 09:47:28 PM »
I think the difference is so small and wonder if it really makes a discernible difference. As stated in o.p I do use a meter and it is calibrated and adjusts for temperature.

Offline dmtaylor

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3299
  • Two Rivers, WI
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2018, 09:56:13 PM »
I think the difference is so small and wonder if it really makes a discernible difference. As stated in o.p I do use a meter and it is calibrated and adjusts for temperature.

WARNING!  WARNING!  NO, it does NOT truly "adjust for temperature".  You absolutely must be cognizant of temperature effects.  Forget anything about "Automatic Temperature Correction".  It's not what you think it is.  Common misconception.  Take note!
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline HopDen

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 28
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2018, 10:24:22 PM »
I think the difference is so small and wonder if it really makes a discernible difference. As stated in o.p I do use a meter and it is calibrated and adjusts for temperature.

WARNING!  WARNING!  NO, it does NOT truly "adjust for temperature".  You absolutely must be cognizant of temperature effects.  Forget anything about "Automatic Temperature Correction".  It's not what you think it is.  Common misconception.  Take note!
Lets get down to brass tacts here and learn me something!!
So,auto correct aside, how do I adjust for temp manually? Slide rule?
« Last Edit: August 09, 2018, 10:25:58 PM by HopDen »

Offline brewinhard

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3233
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2018, 11:00:32 PM »
I think the difference is so small and wonder if it really makes a discernible difference. As stated in o.p I do use a meter and it is calibrated and adjusts for temperature.

WARNING!  WARNING!  NO, it does NOT truly "adjust for temperature".  You absolutely must be cognizant of temperature effects.  Forget anything about "Automatic Temperature Correction".  It's not what you think it is.  Common misconception.  Take note!
Lets get down to brass tacts here and learn me something!!
So,auto correct aside, how do I adjust for temp manually? Slide rule?

My pH meter (milwaukee 101) came with a reference sheet indicating temps of the wort and appropriate buffer pH readings (for both 4 and 7 solutions). When calibrating, I take the temps of the solutions then turn the dial on my meter to match the solution temps prior to calibrating. I then make sure that my wort temp is the same as the reading temperature that I calibrated the pH meter with when I take my mash pH readings.

Offline dmtaylor

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3299
  • Two Rivers, WI
    • View Profile
Re: pH
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2018, 11:25:49 PM »
I think the difference is so small and wonder if it really makes a discernible difference. As stated in o.p I do use a meter and it is calibrated and adjusts for temperature.

WARNING!  WARNING!  NO, it does NOT truly "adjust for temperature".  You absolutely must be cognizant of temperature effects.  Forget anything about "Automatic Temperature Correction".  It's not what you think it is.  Common misconception.  Take note!
Lets get down to brass tacts here and learn me something!!
So,auto correct aside, how do I adjust for temp manually? Slide rule?

At mash temperatures of approximately 150 F, add 0.25 to the pH.  At room temperature, add nothing.  If in between, pick a number in between.

The 0.25 number is not baloney either; it is based on a lot of real data from Kai Troester, Gordon Strong, John Palmer, Ashton Lewis, and..... me.  8)

My pH meter (milwaukee 101) came with a reference sheet indicating temps of the wort and appropriate buffer pH readings (for both 4 and 7 solutions). When calibrating, I take the temps of the solutions then turn the dial on my meter to match the solution temps prior to calibrating. I then make sure that my wort temp is the same as the reading temperature that I calibrated the pH meter with when I take my mash pH readings.

I do something similar to that too.  Good point.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2018, 11:28:23 PM by dmtaylor »
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.