[Dangershark]

Hi there! I've been appreciating and putting to use the great advice on these forums for quite awhile but this is my first time posting. My husband and I have been all-grain homebrewers for several years, but had always followed other people's recipes. We just recently began working on developing our own recipes, but we're still trying to get a better handle on how making small changes to a grain bill can change flavor and other variables.

We brewed what was intended to be an American-style brown ale and were pretty happy with it, but would like to tweak it a bit now and could use some advice. Our original recipe (5 gallons, all grain) was 7.5 lbs US 2-Row, 1 lb Crystal 60, and 0.5 lb Chocolate. Nugget for bittering and Willamette for flavoring/aroma. Fermented with WLP001 California Ale yeast.

The beer is really dark brown, almost black, so we'd like to dial the color down a bit so it looks more like a brown ale and less like a porter, but at the same time increase the "toasty/roasty" flavor of it. We don't want to add more chocolate malt because that would make it even darker, but we also don't want to lose the toastiness the chocolate gives it, and actually want to increase that flavor. We were thinking of replacing a portion of the chocolate malt with something else that would lighten the color but still give it a toasted/roasted flavor, and we read that Victory malt may do this? What would you recommend? Thanks for any advice you can give!

[MNWayne]

Perhaps cut the chocolate by 50% and add a pound of Victory, it's quite tasty. Maybe add some dark Munich too. Small steps work best when experimenting.

[RC]

I think 5% to 10% brown malt would give you what you're wanting here.

[Dangershark]

Perhaps cut the chocolate by 50% and add a pound of Victory, it's quite tasty. Maybe add some dark Munich too. Small steps work best when experimenting.

Thanks for the reply! Learning to experiment is fun but a little bit nerve-wracking at the same while we're getting used to how minor adjustments can completely change a beer. I agree, small steps is definitely the way to go. We'll absolutely give the Victory a shot at your suggested amount. If we added Dark Munich as well, how much would you recommend? And should that be in addition to everything else as is, or as a replacement for a portion of one of the grains?

[Dangershark]

I think 5% to 10% brown malt would give you what you're wanting here.

Thanks for the reply! I don't think I've ever seen brown malt at our local homebrew shop, but I will definitely ask about it when we stop in later today. Would you replace some of the Chocolate and/or Crystal with the brown, or add it in addition to those as is?

[RC]

I think 5% to 10% brown malt would give you what you're wanting here.

Thanks for the reply! I don't think I've ever seen brown malt at our local homebrew shop, but I will definitely ask about it when we stop in later today. Would you replace some of the Chocolate and/or Crystal with the brown, or add it in addition to those as is?

Given what you're desiring here, I suggest dialing down the chocolate malt a smidge to lighten the color and replacing 0.25 to 0.5 lb of the crystal 60 with brown malt. Brown malt will bring in toast/some roast flavors with about the same color contribution as crystal 60. Victory is a great malt but it tastes just like grape nuts cereal; this is the flavor it brings to beer. Sounds like you want more roast flavors though. Brown malt is probably the only way to add some of the roast flavor you want without the added darkness you don't want. It's not nearly as roasty as chocolate malt though...if you like roast, those dark roasted malts are the only way to go.

[Robert]

If you're feeling experimental and/or have a lot of winter cabin fever to deal with, here's something that could be fun.   Take a pound or so of your 2-row (whole not  crushed) and spread it out on a sheet pan.   Place in a 300°F oven, for probably at least a half hour,  but basically wait until you like what you smell.   Cool it, store it and let it mellow for a week or so (the sharper flavors will dissipate)  and try it.  You can get a lot of flavor with not a lot of color.   Randy Mosher's book Radical Brewing has a section on home toasting/ roasting.  Different times and temperatures will produce a wide range of colors and flavors.

[skyler]

Replace the chocolate with pale chocolate or chocolate rye, and consider reducing it. Add brown malt as suggested. If you really want a toasty-biscuity bomb, no malt has ever done that for me more than Weyermann Cara-Rye.

[jeffy]

Replace the chocolate with pale chocolate or chocolate rye, and consider reducing it. Add brown malt as suggested. If you really want a toasty-biscuity bomb, no malt has ever done that for me more than Weyermann Cara-Rye.

I have been using that Wyerman Cara-rye malt at about 10% in my last three APA's and I really like it.  It adds a little color at about 60L and a spicy, toasty flavor.

[BrewBama]

Great advice above. It just goes to show that homebrewers find many roads to Rome.

I like your “On the Ones” style recipe. That’s my style recipe: uncomplicated where the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.

IMO to lighten the color think in percents, reduce your crystal and roast, but add it back to the base. Where you’re sitting at 83% base, 11% caramel/crystal, 5% roast, I recommend something like 92% base, 3% caramel/crystal, 3% roast. To that I’d add 2% Cara-red for a total of 5% for either roast or caramel depending on how you view Cara-red.

Cheers


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[denny]

By way of comparison, here's mine.  It's won me a few awards.  I like it so much I just brewed 2 batches back to back so I'd have plenty on hand.  https://web.archive.org/web/20171105054700/http://wiki.homebrewersassociation.org/NotiBrownAle