Author Topic: Corn Syrup?  (Read 1830 times)

Offline theoman

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Corn Syrup?
« on: August 14, 2010, 03:02:16 AM »
Has anybody ever used corn syrup in a beer? I have some laying around that I don't intend to use for anything else, so I thought I might use it in a tripel-ish recipe. Any reason why I shouldn't?

Offline MDixon

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2010, 04:26:33 AM »
It has vanilla added, so be prepared for that flavor...
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Offline weithman5

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2010, 05:14:45 AM »
let us know.  the little amish general store near my ma's farm has some cheap, as well as pure fructose and some interesting varieties of wheat and oats that may be worthwhile now that i think of it.
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Offline theoman

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2010, 05:06:21 AM »
I just checked the ingredients: Glucose, glucose-fructose, water, refiners' syrup, salt. Hm, could be fun to try, could be a mistake.

Offline dean

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2010, 06:11:16 AM »
I've used it a few times, in fact I'm going to make a batch or two with it again.  Its somewhat similar to using honey but doesn't finish quite as dry imo.  As MDixon said, most have vanilla added so be prepared for that flavor to come through to some extent, use a recipe you'd want some vanilla in it and you're good to go.  I've used it in PA's and Stouts and I've liked them all.  I don't know about using it in an IPA... might be good with the right hops etc.

Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2010, 09:50:09 AM »
I just checked the ingredients: Glucose, glucose-fructose, water, refiners' syrup, salt. Hm, could be fun to try, could be a mistake.
Isn't refiner's syrup sort of like molasses? Is this dark corn syrup?  I don't know if I'd want to add the color or flavor to a tripel.  Have you checked out Ted Hausotter's article on the sugars of tripel?  He gave a presentation at NHC and there was on article in Zymurgy July/Aug 2008

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/0000/4805/Sugars_of_Tripel-Ted_Hausotter.pdf
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Offline The Professor

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2010, 07:45:00 PM »
Light KARO syrup (and similar products) have vanilla added...the dark ones don't seem to.

I've used KING and ALAGA syrups in some brews with interesting results.
Sorghum syrup, if you can find it, is VERY interesting  as a sugar adjunct in some beers.
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Offline MDixon

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2010, 04:52:18 AM »
Thanks for pointing that out, it is indeed the light syrup which has vanilla. I just assumed the original poster was using light since they were attempting to make a tripel...

theo - I would not use dark anything in a tripel  ;)
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Online denny

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2010, 08:50:38 AM »
Isn't refiner's syrup sort of like molasses? Is this dark corn syrup?  I don't know if I'd want to add the color or flavor to a tripel.  Have you checked out Ted Hausotter's article on the sugars of tripel?  He gave a presentation at NHC and there was on article in Zymurgy July/Aug 2008

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/0000/4805/Sugars_of_Tripel-Ted_Hausotter.pdf

As much respect as I have for Ted, my experience is that his results are only valid if you add sugars during fermentation like he did.  If you add them to the kettle, as most of us (and most Belgian brewers) do, I don't find that his results correlate.
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Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2010, 10:13:57 AM »
Isn't refiner's syrup sort of like molasses? Is this dark corn syrup?  I don't know if I'd want to add the color or flavor to a tripel.  Have you checked out Ted Hausotter's article on the sugars of tripel?  He gave a presentation at NHC and there was on article in Zymurgy July/Aug 2008

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/0000/4805/Sugars_of_Tripel-Ted_Hausotter.pdf

As much respect as I have for Ted, my experience is that his results are only valid if you add sugars during fermentation like he did.  If you add them to the kettle, as most of us (and most Belgian brewers) do, I don't find that his results correlate.
That's an interesting point Denny.  But it's a much harder experiment to do when adding sugar during the boil as opposed to fermentation, so I don't really fault Ted for doing it that way (and I'm sure you don't either).  Unless you have your system totally dialed in, you will probably have enough batch to batch variability that could cause any differences noted, at least for the sugars that are similar.

So what are your findings Denny?  What I remember from when we tasted these beers at Ted's judging class in Hood River was that the brown sugar one was the worst tripel, the corn sugar and table sugar were better and similar to each other, and the candy sugar one was only slightly preferred.  It's been a while though.
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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2010, 10:19:14 AM »
That's an interesting point Denny.  But it's a much harder experiment to do when adding sugar during the boil as opposed to fermentation, so I don't really fault Ted for doing it that way (and I'm sure you don't either).  Unless you have your system totally dialed in, you will probably have enough batch to batch variability that could cause any differences noted, at least for the sugars that are similar.

I completely understand why Ted did it that way, but to me it has no relevance to the way I (or many others) brew.  If I don't add sugar to the fermentation, it will have no bearing on my results.

So what are your findings Denny?  What I remember from when we tasted these beers at Ted's judging class in Hood River was that the brown sugar one was the worst tripel, the corn sugar and table sugar were better and similar to each other, and the candy sugar one was only slightly preferred.  It's been a while though.

I wasn't there, but I in no way question the results you guys got.  It's something I discussed with Ted.  Although I haven't done a rigorous experiment like he did, my observations on using sugar in the kettle are that I've found no difference in corn, cane, brown, or candy sugar in the amounts I typically use (10-20% of total fermentables).
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Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2010, 10:27:15 AM »
So what are your findings Denny?  What I remember from when we tasted these beers at Ted's judging class in Hood River was that the brown sugar one was the worst tripel, the corn sugar and table sugar were better and similar to each other, and the candy sugar one was only slightly preferred.  It's been a while though.

I wasn't there, but I in no way question the results you guys got.  It's something I discussed with Ted.  Although I haven't done a rigorous experiment like he did, my observations on using sugar in the kettle are that I've found no difference in corn, cane, brown, or candy sugar in the amounts I typically use (10-20% of total fermentables).
Oh, I just put down what we got for comparison's sake.   :)

I've heard similar things about the sugar form not mattering, but it makes me wonder if there is more batch to batch variability to overcome than differences in the sugar.  When you've done it was it that you can't tell the difference, or there is just no preference?

It would be good if someone did testing in the boil, but it would be a total PITA.  And then you'd have 20 or gallons of tripel, which is good or bad depending on how much you like the style.  :)

Tom Schmidlin

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2010, 10:39:55 AM »
Oh, I just put down what we got for comparison's sake.   :)

I've heard similar things about the sugar form not mattering, but it makes me wonder if there is more batch to batch variability to overcome than differences in the sugar.  When you've done it was it that you can't tell the difference, or there is just no preference?

It would be good if someone did testing in the boil, but it would be a total PITA.  And then you'd have 20 or gallons of tripel, which is good or bad depending on how much you like the style.  :)



The closest I've gotten is doing back to back batches of tripel with different sugars.  I know for a fact that I didn't have a preference, but I couldn't swear there was no difference...although that's my recollection.  I make quite a few batches of tripel and have a standard recipe and technique dialed in, so there shouldn't have been much variation in the beers.  Although as you say, that's damn hard to do.
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Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2010, 10:45:24 AM »
The closest I've gotten is doing back to back batches of tripel with different sugars.  I know for a fact that I didn't have a preference, but I couldn't swear there was no difference...although that's my recollection.  I make quite a few batches of tripel and have a standard recipe and technique dialed in, so there shouldn't have been much variation in the beers.  Although as you say, that's damn hard to do.

Cool Denny, thanks for the detail.  Personally, I usually use palm sugar when I feel like adding gravity to a beer.  I don't really have a good reason for doing it though. :D
Tom Schmidlin

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Re: Corn Syrup?
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2010, 10:50:30 AM »
I recently made my standard tripel recipe using demarara....there was a big difference that was readily noticeable.  A much richer, more caramelly flavor.  It took it out of style for a tripel, but was delicious.
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