[Mr_Beer]

I am having a hard time formulating my question(s) since I am essentially a novice regarding lager beers.

I live in Arkansas – think 100 degrees often in the summer and not so cold in the winter.  Basements are not cold so I had given up on any lager beers and have brewed ale type recipes.

Recently I purchased a Brewjacket device  which will allow me to entertain the notion of larger beer. 

In theory the Brewjacket device will cool a carboy to 30 degrees below ambient temperature.  Assuming a 65 degree ambient I will be able to cool the carboy to 35 degrees. 

So now  the question(s)…
Since I am used to hoppier beers and like darker beers my notion was to brew a Doppelbock recipe for my first experiment.
Any opinions or recommendations for other options on style of beer?
Any recommendations for a lager style dry yeast?

At this point I have read enough to be reasonably confused so I would like some experienced opinions. 

[dls5492]

Doppelbocks are a very malty beer. The hops bitterness is slight, at best. If you like hoppy beers, maybe try one with a lager yeast. About any beer you can brew as an ale you can also brew using lager yeast.
The saflager 34/70 is a nice dry lager yeast.

[KellerBrauer]

You have many options available.  I’m not familiar with the device you will use to cool the fermentation.  But my recommendation is to NOT trust the 35 degree possibility you mentioned in case the device is unable to achieve that goal.  So, I recommend using a Lager yeast that ferments at a warmer temperature at least until you fully trust your cooling device.

For example:
Wyeast American Lager 2035
Min Temp: 48 degrees F
Max Temp: 58 degrees F

If you like hop forward beers, simply select a beer style that looks interesting - the Doppelbock for example - and hop it up a bit! I have done that many times with great success.  Sure, you’re stepping out of the style boundaries, but so what!  After all, you’re in charge - it’s your beer!

The Doppelbock IBU range is: 16-26.  So make yours 36-40 IBU.  I don’t know if I would push the limits farther than that for fear of loosing the sense of balance.  But I think 36-40 would work out well, IMHO.

[Iliff Ave]

So are you saying that you're used to hoppy beers but you want to brew a malty beer?

I'm not sure you would want to tackle a Doppelbock for your first lager but at the same time; why not? Another good option would be a dunkel lager.

As Keller mentioned, when I do bigger maltier beers I like to push the IBUs up to or above the upper limits of the range out of personal preference.

[dmtaylor]

Doppelbock is not a hoppy beer at all.  I would suggest Pilsner as a hoppy lager, or if that is too light in color then perhaps an overly hopped amber Marzen would be good too (a lot of commercial breweries are doing those every September).

For any lagers, I recommend WLP833, Wyeast 2206, or S-189.  Mash low about 148 F for best effect.

Darker yet, you could also try a Sticke Altbier which is a strong dark bitter cold-conditioned ale.  For that style, nothing beats Wyeast 1007.

And these recommendations only matter if you care about sticking with traditional styles.  If you don’t care so much about style, then there are no limitations at all.  My yeast recommendations still stand, those are all solid yeasts.  But you can hop up any style you want, or change the color, or whatever.  It’s your beer.  Brew what you enjoy.

Cheers.

[Robert]

Czech dark lagers are generally much hoppier than German Dunkel, more like a dark Bo Pils.  Look into that style.  And little country breweries all around the land o' lager have always made quirky, idiosyncratic (read:  outside the beer judges' narrow and arbitrary style guidelines) beers.  You can, too.

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[dmtaylor]

Czech dark lagers are generally much hoppier than German Dunkel, more like a dark Bo Pils.  Look into that style.  And little country breweries all around the land o' lager have always made quirky, idiosyncratic (read:  outside the beer judges' narrow and arbitrary style guidelines) beers.  You can, too.

Ah, yes, of course... Czech dark is a style I've heard of but am not personally familiar with.  Thanks for bringing it up.

[Robert]

Czech dark lagers are generally much hoppier than German Dunkel, more like a dark Bo Pils.  Look into that style.  And little country breweries all around the land o' lager have always made quirky, idiosyncratic (read:  outside the beer judges' narrow and arbitrary style guidelines) beers.  You can, too.

Ah, yes, of course... Czech dark is a style I've heard of but am not personally familiar with.  Thanks for bringing it up.

Czech darks also are based on Pilsner malt, with small amounts of crystal and roast for the color, instead of a Munich base, so the palate is rather different from their German counterparts,  which might play better with more hops.  I think BrewBama has a good recipe.

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[BrewBama]

I really enjoyed this Dark Czech Lager. It is based on a recipe from another homebrewer Paulaner which is based on Pivovar Kout na Šumavě Koutský tmavý speciál 14°.

I used

77% Pils
10% Munich
10% Caramunich II
3% Carafa II

22 IBU Saaz at 60 min
13 IBU Saaz at 30 min

Bohemian Lager Yeast (I had to sub my preferred yeast to S-189 because my Homebrew shop was out of Bohemian Lager Yeast. Paulaner used 2278.)


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[Iliff Ave]

I really enjoyed this Dark Czech Lager. It is based on a recipe from another homebrewer Paulaner which is based on Pivovar Kout na Šumavě Koutský tmavý speciál 14°.

I used

77% Pils
10% Munich
10% Caramunich II
3% Carafa II

22 IBU Saaz at 60 min
13 IBU Saaz at 30 min

Bohemian Lager Yeast (I had to sub my preferred yeast to S-189 because my Homebrew shop was out of Bohemian Lager Yeast. Paulaner used 2278.)


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How bad would a bavarian lager yeast be in this? I may give this a shot soon.

[BrewBama]

I really enjoyed this Dark Czech Lager. It is based on a recipe from another homebrewer Paulaner which is based on Pivovar Kout na Šumavě Koutský tmavý speciál 14°.

I used

77% Pils
10% Munich
10% Caramunich II
3% Carafa II

22 IBU Saaz at 60 min
13 IBU Saaz at 30 min

Bohemian Lager Yeast (I had to sub my preferred yeast to S-189 because my Homebrew shop was out of Bohemian Lager Yeast. Paulaner used 2278.)


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How bad would a bavarian lager yeast be in this? I may give this a shot soon.

I think it would be very good. I used S-189 and it was very good. I would like to rebrew with the bohemian lager yeast just to see.


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[Mr_Beer]

I want to take a moment thanking everyone who offered suggestions.  The breadth of experience and innovative approaches suggested along with real life experience was very helpful.

Thanks to all who responded. 

[jeaneallenn]

Thanks man.

I really enjoyed this Dark Czech Lager. It is based on a recipe from another homebrewer Paulaner which is based on Pivovar Kout na Šumavě Koutský tmavý speciál 14°.

I used

77% Pils
10% Munich
10% Caramunich II
3% Carafa II

22 IBU Saaz at 60 min
13 IBU Saaz at 30 min

Bohemian Lager Yeast (I had to sub my preferred yeast to S-189 because my Homebrew shop was out of Bohemian Lager Yeast. Paulaner used 2278.)


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[santoch]

(5 months later)

So, what did you end up brewing and how did it turn out?

I know its way past the OP, but for a really hoppy dark lager I would have suggested you brew a Schwarzbier, though the Czech Dark Lager is a good choice too.

My personal preference is away from many of the Czech beers nowadays.  I seem to have gotten really sensitive to diacetyl over the years and many of the Czech beers (really, its the Czech yeasts that are to blame) throw enough of the dreaded D to spoil them for me, while others folks drinking the same tap just don't pick it up at all.  I envy them, because a clean Czech pils or Czech dark is a joy to drink.

[Mr_Beer]

It has been five months -- enough time to brew and lager my first lager beer.

I choose a  Czech dark lager recipe from BrewBama with a S-189 yeast.  The time involved is longer than I wanted but the reuults are excellent -- much better that I expected.  I understand that I am out of the style guidelines but who cares.  Seven out of six folks drool  after they taste it. 

The recipe will go to my 'top five' list.

Again, thanks to everyone who helped and offered suggestions.