[Belgian Samurai]

Hi,

I am going to brew a Belgian citrus wheat inspired by Blue Moon and I would like your input on tweaking the recipe. I found this recipe somewhere on the Net, which I'm using it as a foundation as I am not particularly impressed with Blue Moon. It's a crowd favorite and my pops likes it, so it will be the beer to christen my new brew chamber build.

Preface notes:
My brew supplies guy will convert all of this to a liquid malts recipe for my convenience.


Blue Moon Recipe (Clone)
(Partial Mash Beer Recipe, 5-Gallon Batch)

Specs
OG: 1.055
FG: 1.014
IBUs: 9
ABV: 5.4%
SRM: 5

Ingredients
6.6 lbs. Wheat LME
1 lb. Two-Row Brewers Malt
1 lb. White Wheat Malt
.75 lb. Flaked Oats
1 oz. Hallertau hops (3.9 AAUs) @ :60
3 oz. Valencia dried sweet orange peel @ :10
EDIT: [Use half;  buy McCormick's dried flakes.]
1.5 tsp. fresh ground coriander @ :10
Wyeast 1056: American Ale Yeast
EDIT: Wyeast 3944 is from hoegardden. {"It is a great strain choice when you want a delicate clove profile not to be overshadowed by esters. It will ferment fairly dry with a slightly tart finish that compliments the use of oats, malted and unmalted wheat." Wyeast}

Directions: Prepare a 2L yeast starter. Mash the two-row malt, wheat malt, and flaked oats in 5 quarts of water. Hold temperature at 154°F. for 60 minutes. Strain the wort into the brew kettle, then rinse grains with 1 gallon of water at 170°F., collecting run-off in the brew kettle. Mix in liquid malt extract and add clean water to bring boil volume to 3.5 gallons. Bring to a boil, add hops, and boil for 60 minutes. Add the orange peel [dried flakes] and coriander in the last 10 minutes of the boil. Chill wort, top off to 5 gallons, and stir to mix and aerate. Pitch yeast and ferment at 65F for one week, then transfer to secondary for two weeks. Bottle with priming sugar and condition for two weeks.

Things I'd like to consider for the recipe...
Cloves: minimal; (taste?, but definitely aroma)
I like complex flavor profiles (not to the degree of making the recipe muddy.) I want a bit higher abv. (Extra pound of sugar to boost it 1%??)

Okay, have at it!
Thanks,
Belgian Samurai 

[denny]

That will be in the ballpark.  People will probably nitpick various aspects, but that will get you close to what you want.

[Belgian Samurai]

That will be in the ballpark.  People will probably nitpick various aspects, but that will get you close to what you want.

Thanks, Denny!

I would like to enlarge the flavor profile of this beer.  So,  we have hallertau hop (
Lightly flowery and spicy aroma) in for 60-minutes and the dried orange flake for complimentary flavoring, and some balancing coriander for the aroma, but essentially,  this is a straight forward orange citrus profile. Let's make it awesome. 

I would like to add some coconut flavor. Option A: cashmere hops last 15 minutes of boil
Option B: secondary with these
toasted coconut chips
https://www.homebrewing.org/Brewers-Best-Toasted-Unsweetened-Coconut-Chips-4oz_p_9592.html

I'm leaning towards adding the chashmere hops though. Any suggestions on quantity? I like how the flavor profile is defined.

Cashmere is described as having delicate yet strong aromas of melon, coconut, citrus notes, such as sweet lemon, lime, lemon peel, or an edge of grapefruit. You may even notice some tropical whispers of pineapple. It may contain woody, spicy notes akin to coriander, especially when boiled.

Edit:
Since the last remark in the above quoted hop taste profile mentions coriander, which I'll already have, and the fact that "smokey" taste might not benefit this beer style, instead of 15-minutes, maybe I'll do 1oz for 10-minutes.

[denny]

That will be in the ballpark.  People will probably nitpick various aspects, but that will get you close to what you want.

Thanks, Denny!

I would like to enlarge the flavor profile of this beer.  So,  we have hallertau hop (
Lightly flowery and spicy aroma) in for 60-minutes and the dried orange flake for complimentary flavoring, and some balancing coriander for the aroma, but essentially,  this is a straight forward orange citrus profile. Let's make it awesome. 

I would like to add some coconut flavor. Option A: cashmere hops last 15 minutes of boil
Option B: secondary with these
toasted coconut chips
https://www.homebrewing.org/Brewers-Best-Toasted-Unsweetened-Coconut-Chips-4oz_p_9592.html

I'm leaning towards adding the chashmere hops though. Any suggestions on quantity? I like how the flavor profile is defined.

Cashmere is described as having delicate yet strong aromas of melon, coconut, citrus notes, such as sweet lemon, lime, lemon peel, or an edge of grapefruit. You may even notice some tropical whispers of pineapple. It may contain woody, spicy notes akin to coriander, especially when boiled.

Edit:
Since the last remark in the above quoted hop taste profile mentions coriander, which I'll already have, and the fact that "smokey" taste might not benefit this beer style, instead of 15-minutes, maybe I'll do 1oz for 10-minutes.

It depends on how much coconut flavor you want.  I' start by questioning if you want any at all with the orange flavors and phenols from the yeast.  If you do, coconut would be the best way to get it.  It would be very subtle, if at all, from the hops.  Remember, you don't have to throw the kitchen sink at it.

[Belgian Samurai]

It depends on how much coconut flavor you want.  I' start by questioning if you want any at all with the orange flavors and phenols from the yeast.  If you do, coconut would be the best way to get it.  It would be very subtle, if at all, from the hops.  Remember, you don't have to throw the kitchen sink at it.

Hahaha I was thinking about bringing in the outdoor sink too.  Lol

Thanks!

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

[jeffy]

I usually add some chamomile in my Witbier at the 10 minute mark.  It adds a nice floral aroma and a sweet-ish flavor.  I am not sure about the coconut though.

[Belgian Samurai]

I usually add some chamomile in my Witbier at the 10 minute mark.  It adds a nice floral aroma and a sweet-ish flavor.  I am not sure about the coconut though.

Thanks! I'm making mental note about chamomile.



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[denny]

I usually add some chamomile in my Witbier at the 10 minute mark.  It adds a nice floral aroma and a sweet-ish flavor.  I am not sure about the coconut though.

Yeah, I do the same with chamomile.

[Steve Ruch]

That will be in the ballpark.  People will probably nitpick various aspects, but that will get you close to what you want.

Thanks, Denny!

I would like to enlarge the flavor profile of this beer.  So,  we have hallertau hop (
Lightly flowery and spicy aroma) in for 60-minutes and the dried orange flake for complimentary flavoring, and some balancing coriander for the aroma, but essentially,  this is a straight forward orange citrus profile. Let's make it awesome. 

I would like to add some coconut flavor. Option A: cashmere hops last 15 minutes of boil
Option B: secondary with these
toasted coconut chips
https://www.homebrewing.org/Brewers-Best-Toasted-Unsweetened-Coconut-Chips-4oz_p_9592.html

I'm leaning towards adding the chashmere hops though. Any suggestions on quantity? I like how the flavor profile is defined.

Cashmere is described as having delicate yet strong aromas of melon, coconut, citrus notes, such as sweet lemon, lime, lemon peel, or an edge of grapefruit. You may even notice some tropical whispers of pineapple. It may contain woody, spicy notes akin to coriander, especially when boiled.

Edit:
Since the last remark in the above quoted hop taste profile mentions coriander, which I'll already have, and the fact that "smokey" taste might not benefit this beer style, instead of 15-minutes, maybe I'll do 1oz for 10-minutes.

It depends on how much coconut flavor you want.  I' start by questioning if you want any at all with the orange flavors and phenols from the yeast.  If you do, coconut would be the best way to get it.  It would be very subtle, if at all, from the hops.  Remember, you don't have to throw the kitchen sink at it.

I recently did a coconut wheat beer. 8 ounces of fresh coconut in a 2 gallon batch gave a nice coconut flavor, but it didn't have to compete with orange peel, coriender, or an assertive yeast.

[Belgian Samurai]

That will be in the ballpark.  People will probably nitpick various aspects, but that will get you close to what you want.

Thanks, Denny!

I would like to enlarge the flavor profile of this beer.  So,  we have hallertau hop (
Lightly flowery and spicy aroma) in for 60-minutes and the dried orange flake for complimentary flavoring, and some balancing coriander for the aroma, but essentially,  this is a straight forward orange citrus profile. Let's make it awesome. 

I would like to add some coconut flavor. Option A: cashmere hops last 15 minutes of boil
Option B: secondary with these
toasted coconut chips
https://www.homebrewing.org/Brewers-Best-Toasted-Unsweetened-Coconut-Chips-4oz_p_9592.html

I'm leaning towards adding the chashmere hops though. Any suggestions on quantity? I like how the flavor profile is defined.

Cashmere is described as having delicate yet strong aromas of melon, coconut, citrus notes, such as sweet lemon, lime, lemon peel, or an edge of grapefruit. You may even notice some tropical whispers of pineapple. It may contain woody, spicy notes akin to coriander, especially when boiled.

Edit:
Since the last remark in the above quoted hop taste profile mentions coriander, which I'll already have, and the fact that "smokey" taste might not benefit this beer style, instead of 15-minutes, maybe I'll do 1oz for 10-minutes.

It depends on how much coconut flavor you want.  I' start by questioning if you want any at all with the orange flavors and phenols from the yeast.  If you do, coconut would be the best way to get it.  It would be very subtle, if at all, from the hops.  Remember, you don't have to throw the kitchen sink at it.

I recently did a coconut wheat beer. 8 ounces of fresh coconut in a 2 gallon batch gave a nice coconut flavor, but it didn't have to compete with orange peel, coriender, or an assertive yeast.

How long was your secondary fermentation with that coconut? 20 oz of coconut chips sounds like a lot and since I'm not going to a true coconut wheat ale, I am leaning towards 8-10 oz for the 5 gallon batch. Thoughts?

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

[Steve Ruch]

That will be in the ballpark.  People will probably nitpick various aspects, but that will get you close to what you want.

Thanks, Denny!

I would like to enlarge the flavor profile of this beer.  So,  we have hallertau hop (
Lightly flowery and spicy aroma) in for 60-minutes and the dried orange flake for complimentary flavoring, and some balancing coriander for the aroma, but essentially,  this is a straight forward orange citrus profile. Let's make it awesome. 

I would like to add some coconut flavor. Option A: cashmere hops last 15 minutes of boil
Option B: secondary with these
toasted coconut chips
https://www.homebrewing.org/Brewers-Best-Toasted-Unsweetened-Coconut-Chips-4oz_p_9592.html

I'm leaning towards adding the chashmere hops though. Any suggestions on quantity? I like how the flavor profile is defined.

Cashmere is described as having delicate yet strong aromas of melon, coconut, citrus notes, such as sweet lemon, lime, lemon peel, or an edge of grapefruit. You may even notice some tropical whispers of pineapple. It may contain woody, spicy notes akin to coriander, especially when boiled.

Edit:
Since the last remark in the above quoted hop taste profile mentions coriander, which I'll already have, and the fact that "smokey" taste might not benefit this beer style, instead of 15-minutes, maybe I'll do 1oz for 10-minutes.

It depends on how much coconut flavor you want.  I' start by questioning if you want any at all with the orange flavors and phenols from the yeast.  If you do, coconut would be the best way to get it.  It would be very subtle, if at all, from the hops.  Remember, you don't have to throw the kitchen sink at it.

I recently did a coconut wheat beer. 8 ounces of fresh coconut in a 2 gallon batch gave a nice coconut flavor, but it didn't have to compete with orange peel, coriender, or an assertive yeast.

How long was your secondary fermentation with that coconut? 20 oz of coconut chips sounds like a lot and since I'm not going to a true coconut wheat ale, I am leaning towards 8-10 oz for the 5 gallon batch. Thoughts?

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

Two weeks of primary and one week with the coconut. I used 8 ozs. of fresh coconut in 2 gallons. I think I got more coconut flavor than the previous batch that used dried.

[Belgian Samurai]

Two weeks of primary and one week with the coconut. I used 8 ozs. of fresh coconut in 2 gallons. I think I got more coconut flavor than the previous batch that used dried.

Ooh, I like the idea of fresh coconut! I think I'll do that. Did you meausure that 8 oz in a measuring cup or on a kitchen scale?

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

[Steve Ruch]

Two weeks of primary and one week with the coconut. I used 8 ozs. of fresh coconut in 2 gallons. I think I got more coconut flavor than the previous batch that used dried.

Ooh, I like the idea of fresh coconut! I think I'll do that. Did you meausure that 8 oz in a measuring cup or on a kitchen scale?

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

Scale.
FYI the head disappeared very quickly with the fresh coconut.

[Belgian Samurai]

Two weeks of primary and one week with the coconut. I used 8 ozs. of fresh coconut in 2 gallons. I think I got more coconut flavor than the previous batch that used dried.

Ooh, I like the idea of fresh coconut! I think I'll do that. Did you meausure that 8 oz in a measuring cup or on a kitchen scale?

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

Scale.
FYI the head disappeared very quickly with the fresh coconut.

Question... I don't have a kitchen scale,  so how much should I aim for? 1/4 cup? 1/2?

Also,  I bought a fresh coconut and am going to bake the coconut chips until the begin to carmelize.

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

[Steve Ruch]

Two weeks of primary and one week with the coconut. I used 8 ozs. of fresh coconut in 2 gallons. I think I got more coconut flavor than the previous batch that used dried.

Ooh, I like the idea of fresh coconut! I think I'll do that. Did you meausure that 8 oz in a measuring cup or on a kitchen scale?

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

Scale.
FYI the head disappeared very quickly with the fresh coconut.

Question... I don't have a kitchen scale,  so how much should I aim for? 1/4 cup? 1/2?

Also,  I bought a fresh coconut and am going to bake the coconut chips until the begin to carmelize.

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

I just used what the coconut had which happened to be a tiny bit over 8 ounces.