Author Topic: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?  (Read 5051 times)

Offline dmtaylor

  • Official Poobah of No Life. (I Got Ban Hammered by Drew)
  • *********
  • Posts: 4492
  • Lord Idiot the Lazy
    • YEAST MASTER Perma-Living
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #15 on: February 29, 2020, 06:01:47 am »
My last 34/70 pitch is all I can remember. 2.6 gallos of 1053 wort with 1 pack of yeast. Temp was 56-57F. Krausen appeared at 24 hours.

If there are no signs of fermentation activity within the next 14 hours (40 hours total), a good fresh pack of Wyeast will be purchased and pitched. Maybe 2 smack-packs.

Yeah check again this morning, then if necessary add 2 more packs. I am really surprised by the long lag. You pitched plenty of yeast, it should be rolling like bonkers by now. I don’t recall though if this yeast stays on bottom with zero krausen. There are some yeasts that do that.
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline BrewBama

  • Official Poobah of No Life. (I Got Ban Hammered by Drew)
  • *********
  • Posts: 5203
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #16 on: February 29, 2020, 06:26:45 am »
Did you use yeast nutrient?  That may be the difference in the lag time I am seeing and the times you’re seeing. I use nutrient routinely.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

TXFlyGuy

  • Guest
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #17 on: February 29, 2020, 06:32:51 am »
My last 34/70 pitch is all I can remember. 2.6 gallos of 1053 wort with 1 pack of yeast. Temp was 56-57F. Krausen appeared at 24 hours.

If there are no signs of fermentation activity within the next 14 hours (40 hours total), a good fresh pack of Wyeast will be purchased and pitched. Maybe 2 smack-packs.

Yeah check again this morning, then if necessary add 2 more packs. I am really surprised by the long lag. You pitched plenty of yeast, it should be rolling like bonkers by now. I don’t recall though if this yeast stays on bottom with zero krausen. There are some yeasts that do that.

As of 6AM, there is a very slight foam/krausen forming on top. No CO2 yet. The total lag time is 36 hours.

TXFlyGuy

  • Guest
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #18 on: February 29, 2020, 06:36:27 am »
Did you use yeast nutrient?  That may be the difference in the lag time I am seeing and the times you’re seeing. I use nutrient routinely.

In over 20 years of brewing, we have never used a yeast nutrient. Also, our typical lag times range from less than one hour to 8 hours.
I understand that many brewers use a nutrient, but the yeast used prior to this one (W-34/70) never suffered due to lack of nutrients. We always aerate well, plus add pure O2 to the wort.
« Last Edit: February 29, 2020, 06:39:35 am by Myron Oleson »

Offline dmtaylor

  • Official Poobah of No Life. (I Got Ban Hammered by Drew)
  • *********
  • Posts: 4492
  • Lord Idiot the Lazy
    • YEAST MASTER Perma-Living
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #19 on: February 29, 2020, 06:54:18 am »
Yeah check again this morning, then if necessary add 2 more packs. I am really surprised by the long lag. You pitched plenty of yeast, it should be rolling like bonkers by now. I don’t recall though if this yeast stays on bottom with zero krausen. There are some yeasts that do that.

As of 6AM, there is a very slight foam/krausen forming on top. No CO2 yet. The total lag time is 36 hours.

Alright!  You're good to go!

No need for any nutrient IMO.
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline majorvices

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 11126
  • Polka. If its too loud you're too young.
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #20 on: February 29, 2020, 06:56:15 am »
I have used this yeast for years, both pro and home brew and have always gotten consistent results. A couple of things you might consider: Pitch at or near the temp you want to ferment. So if you are planning to ferment at 50 degrees pitch at 48-52. By pitching yeast and dropping the temp you are sending mixed signals to the yeast. rapidly dropping temps can cause yeast to stall and lag. Also, you might try rehydrating the yeast in preboiled water (@ 70ish degrees).

regardless, under 48 hour lag is nothing to really worry about. Sounds like it is taking off finally and will be chugging away soon.

Offline MNWayne

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 387
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #21 on: February 29, 2020, 07:39:34 am »
In my opinion, the time spent on a starter is a good investment.  Lag time is reduced which reduces anything wild from gaining a significant foothold and it eliminates worry.
Far better to dare mighty things....

TXFlyGuy

  • Guest
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #22 on: February 29, 2020, 07:50:01 am »
Yeah check again this morning, then if necessary add 2 more packs. I am really surprised by the long lag. You pitched plenty of yeast, it should be rolling like bonkers by now. I don’t recall though if this yeast stays on bottom with zero krausen. There are some yeasts that do that.

As of 6AM, there is a very slight foam/krausen forming on top. No CO2 yet. The total lag time is 36 hours.

Alright!  You're good to go!

No need for any nutrient IMO.

Yes! Active CO2 discharge now in the blow off tubing/jar. I feel better now...time for a beer!

TXFlyGuy

  • Guest
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #23 on: February 29, 2020, 07:52:30 am »
In my opinion, the time spent on a starter is a good investment.  Lag time is reduced which reduces anything wild from gaining a significant foothold and it eliminates worry.

I agree, and we have made starters with good success.
We direct pitched this yeast based on the manufacturer's recommendations, plus feedback on this forum indicating
re-hydration (i.e., starter) was not needed.

Offline dmtaylor

  • Official Poobah of No Life. (I Got Ban Hammered by Drew)
  • *********
  • Posts: 4492
  • Lord Idiot the Lazy
    • YEAST MASTER Perma-Living
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #24 on: February 29, 2020, 08:01:15 am »
Your experience seems very unusual.  I still would NOT recommend a starter or special treatment for this yeast strain.  Just an anomaly.
Dave

The world will become a much more pleasant place to live when each and every one of us realizes that we are all idiots.

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 25495
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • Dennybrew
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #25 on: February 29, 2020, 08:21:54 am »
I have used dry 34/70 only a few times, pitching  both directly and rehydrated, and saw much longer lag times than equivalent liquid yeasts.   Just a couple more data points, though, my experience with the dry yeast is very limited.  I really hoped it would prove a convenient alternative to liquid culture, but did not like its performance or the beer it made.  That said, I no longer care for the 34/70 yeasts in general.

Unless a miracle happens overnight, this is the first and last time we use this yeast. We have never had any yeast with a lag time of 26-28 hours, liquid or dry.

I guess I'm in the camp of "so what?".  I haven't found a long lag to have ny negative effects.  Now, if you were t 72 hours with no action I'd have a different opinion.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 25495
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • Dennybrew
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #26 on: February 29, 2020, 08:23:50 am »
In my opinion, the time spent on a starter is a good investment.  Lag time is reduced which reduces anything wild from gaining a significant foothold and it eliminates worry.

No starter for dry yeast, though.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 25495
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • Dennybrew
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #27 on: February 29, 2020, 08:24:22 am »
Your experience seems very unusual.  I still would NOT recommend a starter or special treatment for this yeast strain.  Just an anomaly.

I agree.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

TXFlyGuy

  • Guest
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #28 on: February 29, 2020, 09:41:17 am »
Your experience seems very unusual.  I still would NOT recommend a starter or special treatment for this yeast strain.  Just an anomaly.

I agree.

Most of my experience is with liquid yeast, either smack-pack pitching, or employing yeast harvested from a previous ferment. Most lags are in the single digits for hours. Sometimes there has been nearly zero lag time, with the healthy yeast (from a local brewery) kicking off immediately.

While 36 hours may seem unusual in this case, it appears that it is more common than what may be fully realized based on my search of various brewing forums.

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 25495
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • Dennybrew
Re: Lag Time - Saflager W-34/70?
« Reply #29 on: February 29, 2020, 09:59:56 am »
Your experience seems very unusual.  I still would NOT recommend a starter or special treatment for this yeast strain.  Just an anomaly.

I agree.

Most of my experience is with liquid yeast, either smack-pack pitching, or employing yeast harvested from a previous ferment. Most lags are in the single digits for hours. Sometimes there has been nearly zero lag time, with the healthy yeast (from a local brewery) kicking off immediately.

While 36 hours may seem unusual in this case, it appears that it is more common than what may be fully realized based on my search of various brewing forums.

Indeed. And personally I have found it to be no problem.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell