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Author Topic: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?  (Read 3325 times)

Offline trapae

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Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« on: April 13, 2020, 09:57:56 am »
Just finished my first lager, a Bavarian Pilsner, and now I’m excited about making more lagers.  I’ve been reading and trying to decide which one to make next. Just wondering from people who have more lager knowledge than me, what’s the major differences between Marzen and a Dunkel? Seems to me a Marsen has less Munich malt, higher alcohol, and higher IBUs in general? Thanks.
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Offline denny

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2020, 10:21:51 am »
A maerzen is also lighter in color than a dunkel.
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2020, 11:33:37 am »
I assume you looked st the BJCP guidelines. You might do some recipe web searches and see if that helps.

Märzen is more of a strength designation. One of my favorite Märzens is Schlenkerla's Rauachbier Marzen, which is surprisingly dark.

Dunkels are mostly Dark Munich malt, but there is a wide range of what ix used. Some Dunkels are not that dark, some are very Dunkel i.e. darl.

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Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2020, 02:22:14 pm »
Without looking things up, roughly, in my mind:

Marzen is like 60-70% pilsner malt, and 30-40% Munich malt.

Dunkel is close to 100% Munich malt.

That's the biggest difference.  Other than that, I enjoy both styles equally well and they are indeed quite similar.
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Offline trapae

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2020, 11:34:29 pm »
Anyone have a good Dunkel recipe they’d like to share?
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Offline Ellismr

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2020, 04:11:14 am »
Anyone have a good Dunkel recipe they’d like to share?

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12.2 lbs Munich
6.0 oz Carafa II
Hallertau hops at 60 & 20 to achieve 22 IBU

Yeast: WLP 830, Wyeast 2308, Saflager S-23

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Offline fredthecat

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2020, 09:49:54 pm »
I think of a maerzen as a ~6% basic helles maybe with a tiny bit more munich taste.

A dunkel can be a legitimate beer.

Offline jeffy

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2020, 08:30:12 am »
Anyone have a good Dunkel recipe they’d like to share?
This was the second of two attempts (after tweeking the first recipe for too much roast character):
63% Weyermann Barke Munich 9L
32% W. Barke Pils 2L
2.5% Melanoidin 20L
2.5% Carafa II 440L
First wort hop - Edelweiss (from Hop Heaven) 21 IBUs (per Beersmith, Tinseth)
Edelweiss at 10 minutes 3 IBUs
O.G. 1.050
Lager yeast of your choice
Jeff Gladish, Tampa (989.3, 175.1 Apparent Rennarian)
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AHA member since 1991, now a lifetime member
BJCP judge since 1995

Offline trapae

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2020, 07:35:06 pm »
Thanks, I’ve seen two basic types of recipes, one with nearly 100% Munich malt, and one with about a third Pilsner malt. Sounds like you like the one with some Pilsner in it.  I’ll probably start with one like that.👍🏽    I used barke malt on my Bavarian Pilsner and loved it. Did you do a 90 minute boil due to the Pilsner malt?
I am a great believer in luck, and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it.

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2020, 08:16:19 pm »
Thanks, I’ve seen two basic types of recipes, one with nearly 100% Munich malt, and one with about a third Pilsner malt. Sounds like you like the one with some Pilsner in it.  I’ll probably start with one like that.👍🏽    I used barke malt on my Bavarian Pilsner and loved it. Did you do a 90 minute boil due to the Pilsner malt?

The classic old ones might be 99% dark Munich, 1% Carafa. You can find some Munich malt that is 40 EBC (14.7 L) by Durst and Avangard, or use the Dark from Weyermann which is 9-10L.

Some use the Weyermann Dark, 20-30% Pils, 5% CaraMunich, 1% Carafa.

There are many grain bills. There are different processes too. Some still decoct their Dunkels.
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Offline jeffy

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Re: Difference between a Marzen and a Dunkel?
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2020, 09:46:41 am »
Thanks, I’ve seen two basic types of recipes, one with nearly 100% Munich malt, and one with about a third Pilsner malt. Sounds like you like the one with some Pilsner in it.  I’ll probably start with one like that.👍🏽    I used barke malt on my Bavarian Pilsner and loved it. Did you do a 90 minute boil due to the Pilsner malt?

The classic old ones might be 99% dark Munich, 1% Carafa. You can find some Munich malt that is 40 EBC (14.7 L) by Durst and Avangard, or use the Dark from Weyermann which is 9-10L.

Some use the Weyermann Dark, 20-30% Pils, 5% CaraMunich, 1% Carafa.

There are many grain bills. There are different processes too. Some still decoct their Dunkels.
My first attempt was almost entirely Munich with twice the amount of melanoidin and Carafa, per a recipe by Gordon Strong.  I changed it because of the excessive (to me) roast character and the overly malty flavor.  I wanted more “drinkability” and succeeded in the second attempt.
Jeff Gladish, Tampa (989.3, 175.1 Apparent Rennarian)
Homebrewing since 1990
AHA member since 1991, now a lifetime member
BJCP judge since 1995