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Author Topic: Whole hops  (Read 1285 times)

Offline Saccharomyces

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Whole hops
« on: January 31, 2021, 11:23:12 am »
For the life of me, I cannot understand why whole hops are labeled "leaf hops" when they are actually female flowers.  It is just one of those ingrained brewing terms that defies logic. 

Offline Wilbur

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2021, 11:32:19 am »
Technically most of what you see is a Bract, or modified leaf that is associated with the hop flower. There are many plants which we commonly mistake the brace for the flower, such as dogwood. The white petals of the dogwood are not the flower, but the bracts surrounding the much smaller flower.

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Edit: Auto correct issues
« Last Edit: January 31, 2021, 02:22:57 pm by Wilbur »

Offline RC

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2021, 12:33:44 pm »
It's generally believed that flowers evolved from leaves. Thus, flowers are just highly specialized leaves that have evolved a different function. Calling them "leaf" hops isn't, strictly speaking, wrong.

Offline erockrph

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2021, 02:21:27 pm »
That's one that bugs me too. I always refer to them as whole cones.
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Offline Saccharomyces

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2021, 09:14:25 pm »
Technically most of what you see is a Bract, or modified leaf that is associated with the hop flower. There are many plants which we commonly mistake the brace for the flower, such as dogwood. The white petals of the dogwood are not the flower, but the bracts surrounding the much smaller flower.

Technically, hop cones are strobiles.  However, they are distinct from the plant's leaves.  Referring to hop cones as "leaf hops" is a prime example of one cannot fix stupid.  The crazy part is that term is most heavily used by hop brokers. 

Here is a CTZ plant in my old hop yard that threw female and male flowers:

« Last Edit: January 31, 2021, 09:18:10 pm by Saccharomyces »

Offline Wilbur

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2021, 09:43:48 pm »
Technically most of what you see is a Bract, or modified leaf that is associated with the hop flower. There are many plants which we commonly mistake the brace for the flower, such as dogwood. The white petals of the dogwood are not the flower, but the bracts surrounding the much smaller flower.

Technically, hop cones are strobiles.  However, they are distinct from the plant's leaves.  Referring to hop cones as "leaf hops" is a prime example of one cannot fix stupid.  The crazy part is that term is most heavily used by hop brokers. 

Here is a CTZ plant in my old hop yard that threw female and male flowers:





Quote
In botany, a bract is a modified or specialized leaf, especially one associated with a reproductive structure such as a flower, inflorescence axis or cone scale.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bract

It's quite possible that they use the term because it's perfectly correct. If the body of the cone (or strobile) is made of bracts and bracts are specialized leaves, then it seems quite reasonable to describe the leafy hop cone as "leaf hops". I can quote other sources, but my wife's horticulture textbooks are all the way down in the basement.


The anatomy of the dogwood bract and flower:


Edit: First pic wasn't showing up.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2021, 09:54:19 pm by Wilbur »

Offline goose

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2021, 07:45:46 am »
Technically most of what you see is a Bract, or modified leaf that is associated with the hop flower. There are many plants which we commonly mistake the brace for the flower, such as dogwood. The white petals of the dogwood are not the flower, but the bracts surrounding the much smaller flower.

Technically, hop cones are strobiles.  However, they are distinct from the plant's leaves.  Referring to hop cones as "leaf hops" is a prime example of one cannot fix stupid.  The crazy part is that term is most heavily used by hop brokers. 

Here is a CTZ plant in my old hop yard that threw female and male flowers:

[img width=
640 height=480]https://i.imgur.com/CRGPewA.jpg[/img]

My Nugget did the same thing.  I dug out the 10 year old plant because there were less female flowers than there were male ones.  Going to plant one moe Cascade rhizome in its place.

BTW, I see some Japanese Beetle holes in your leaves as well.  I have that problem here too, but the beetles don't eat the flowers, just the leaves.  :)
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2021, 08:08:40 am »
At Hop School there was a plant with mixed female and male flowers. Someone asked if that was a cross pollination issue, and would it be ripped out. The guide in the yard said, no those male flowers were sterile. He would know, it was Jason Perrault, one of the top hop breeders in the world.
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Offline reverseapachemaster

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2021, 11:27:35 pm »
It's an imprecise term but visually makes sense. If you tear into a pound or pallet sack of whole cones you're usually looking at a pile of what looks like...leaves. It probably derived from sales material to distinguish from pellets where space matters and "leaf hops" takes a lot less space than "whole cone hops" on labeling or sales forms. While imprecise, everybody buying hops pretty well knows exactly what that means.
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Offline chinaski

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2021, 04:35:39 pm »
Don't get me started- flying lemurs aren't lemurs and do not fly.  Language is tricky and often imprecise.

Offline reverseapachemaster

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Re: Whole hops
« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2021, 04:38:05 pm »
Don't get me started- flying lemurs aren't lemurs and do not fly.  Language is tricky and often imprecise.

But wouldn't we like lemurs to fly?
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