[Jayborracho]

Hey all lookin for some advice on when to use hallertau Mittelfruh. I’m trying to get that delicate hop flavor along with its bitterness, spice and floral qualities in my next pale lager but without overpowering the malt character, I’m thinking 60,10,0 but can’t really decide how many ibus to shoot for etc? Any insight would help.

[Bob357]

Looking at the BJCP guidelines for the style will give you a good idea of what's normal.

[ynotbrusum]

I would use it as a late hop addition and use a lighter touch of German magnum for the bittering.  Consider a First Wort Hopping with the Magnum, rather than at 60 minutes.  The HMF will shine at 30’, 10’ or knockout/whirlpool.   Cheers!

[Homebrew_kev]

I did a pislner with a lot of mittlefrueh. I bittered with Magnum

1oz mittlefrueh/saaz at 10min
2oz mittlefrueh/saaz whrilpool
2oz mittlefrueh/saaz dry hop during diacytal rest

I got a prominant flower aroma/flavor and a nice subtle sweetness. I didn't perceive and grain or bread character.

[dmtaylor]

I get the right spice and floral flavors just from boiling for 60 minutes.  No later additions necessary, at least not in a German lager style.

[Cliffs]

I get the right spice and floral flavors just from boiling for 60 minutes.  No later additions necessary, at least not in a German lager style.

agreed. I like to boil most of my noble hops for at least 20 minutes. HMF is a tough hop to use to bitter sometimes because with its low AA, it can take a ton to get any IBU's though FYI, I hate the way most noble hops, including HMF taste when you use them as a dry hop.

[neuse]

I get the right spice and floral flavors just from boiling for 60 minutes.  No later additions necessary, at least not in a German lager style.

agreed. I like to boil most of my noble hops for at least 20 minutes. HMF is a tough hop to use to bitter sometimes because with its low AA, it can take a ton to get any IBU's though FYI, I hate the way most noble hops, including HMF taste when you use them as a dry hop.

I'm glad to see others have experienced this. I've seen the same effect and wondered why. I use HMF as the bittering hop and get the hop flavors from it. I'm thinking of trying Mt. Hood soon using the same method. Has anybody tried this with Mt. Hood or other noble hops?

[Cliffs]

I get the right spice and floral flavors just from boiling for 60 minutes.  No later additions necessary, at least not in a German lager style.

agreed. I like to boil most of my noble hops for at least 20 minutes. HMF is a tough hop to use to bitter sometimes because with its low AA, it can take a ton to get any IBU's though FYI, I hate the way most noble hops, including HMF taste when you use them as a dry hop.

I'm glad to see others have experienced this. I've seen the same effect and wondered why. I use HMF as the bittering hop and get the hop flavors from it. I'm thinking of trying Mt. Hood soon using the same method. Has anybody tried this with Mt. Hood or other noble hops?

I pretty much exclusively use domestic hops like Mt. Hood, Liberty and Willamette instead of their European counterpart and yeah, same thing, I like them boiled for at least 20 minutes.

[erockrph]

I get the right spice and floral flavors just from boiling for 60 minutes.  No later additions necessary, at least not in a German lager style.

agreed. I like to boil most of my noble hops for at least 20 minutes. HMF is a tough hop to use to bitter sometimes because with its low AA, it can take a ton to get any IBU's though FYI, I hate the way most noble hops, including HMF taste when you use them as a dry hop.

I'm glad to see others have experienced this. I've seen the same effect and wondered why. I use HMF as the bittering hop and get the hop flavors from it. I'm thinking of trying Mt. Hood soon using the same method. Has anybody tried this with Mt. Hood or other noble hops?

I pretty much exclusively use domestic hops like Mt. Hood, Liberty and Willamette instead of their European counterpart and yeah, same thing, I like them boiled for at least 20 minutes.

Sterling is an exception to this rule as far as US noble hybrids go. Low amounts early in the boil is very Saaz-like, but larger amounts at the end of the boil or dry-hopped gives a nice touch of lemon character. This versatility  is why I use so much of it.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[Village Taphouse]

I kind of feel like there is no wrong answer.  You can bitter with it.  You can FWH with it and you can use it late.  Hell, you could DH with it if that's your thing.  I have made a very pale and delicate wort with just pilsner and maybe Vienna or Munich 1 (90/10) and then used something like HM to bitter and I would boil for only 30 minutes so I would need more hops than I would need for a 60 and then... no more hops in the boil.  I might get 20 IBUs from that 30-minute addition and with the grist so simple, it's surprising how robust the hops can be and how much character you get from them.  The same could be said for many good, fresh hops including Edelweiss, Liberty, Mt. Hood, Sterling, Northern Brewer, etc. 

[Jayborracho]

Thanks all, all this has me deciding to just go with the bittering addition, can’t wait to see the flavor result

[Village Taphouse]

I should mention too that a beer with one hop addition is something I do a lot of and I really like it.  I get what the hops are contributing to the beer without my tastebuds being accosted and interrogated by hops for the entire session.   I realize there is a place and time for everything but one-hop-addition recipes are very, very common here. 

[jeffy]

I should mention too that a beer with one hop addition is something I do a lot of and I really like it.  I get what the hops are contributing to the beer without my tastebuds being accosted and interrogated by hops for the entire session.   I realize there is a place and time for everything but one-hop-addition recipes are very, very common here.

I like your phrase, "tastebuds being accosted and interrogated by hops."
I usually use two hops per brew (unless I'm doing a smash), one higher aa for bittering and one at the end of the boil.  Sunday I did a pale lager,  first wort hop with Magnum and Hall Mitt at 10 minutes.

[Village Taphouse]

I should mention too that a beer with one hop addition is something I do a lot of and I really like it.  I get what the hops are contributing to the beer without my tastebuds being accosted and interrogated by hops for the entire session.   I realize there is a place and time for everything but one-hop-addition recipes are very, very common here.

I like your phrase, "tastebuds being accosted and interrogated by hops."
I usually use two hops per brew (unless I'm doing a smash), one higher aa for bittering and one at the end of the boil.  Sunday I did a pale lager,  first wort hop with Magnum and Hall Mitt at 10 minutes.

I have something like that on tap but wouldn't you know it... I have a beer carbing now with a bunch of Citra, Amarillo and Simcoe including a dry hop so you just never know.  I rarely make beers like that but I will occasionally.  I make something that I'll call an "American Pub Ale"... 2-row or maybe MO/GP, some crystal or Special B, maybe midnight wheat to about 10-12 SRM, then one hop addition to maybe 25-30 IBUs and it might be Northern Brewer, Glacier, Ultra, Sterling, Santiam, Liberty, Crystal, Mt. Hood, Styrian Goldings, etc. and then a neutral ale hop like 1056/WLP001/BRY-97 or something like 1968/1469/1028, etc.  Simple.  Straightforward.  Delicious.  One hop addition. 

[Jayborracho]

I kind of feel like there is no wrong answer.  You can bitter with it.  You can FWH with it and you can use it late.  Hell, you could DH with it if that's your thing.  I have made a very pale and delicate wort with just pilsner and maybe Vienna or Munich 1 (90/10) and then used something like HM to bitter and I would boil for only 30 minutes so I would need more hops than I would need for a 60 and then... no more hops in the boil.  I might get 20 IBUs from that 30-minute addition and with the grist so simple, it's surprising how robust the hops can be and how much character you get from them.  The same could be said for many good, fresh hops including Edelweiss, Liberty, Mt. Hood, Sterling, Northern Brewer, etc.

This sounds like a great technique, I’ve seen the quality of your beers and I know that you definitely know your stuff